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   Home » Horn-Loaded Speakers» How to USE “Resonating Oops” in loudspeakers (184 posts, 10 pages)
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  »  New  The elusive “absolute tone”...  Breeze......  Playback Listening  Forum     24  152220  07-28-2005
  »  New  The “Primary Frequencies”...  Melody range and the other octaves...  Audio For Dummies ™  Forum     5  48793  09-08-2005
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  »  New  Great Cello Concertos..  János Starker passed away...  Musical Discussions  Forum     21  136250  07-04-2006
  »  New  SPUnisation of Macondo: how to catch own testicals...  Who? (shades of the old "musical" vs. "a...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     1  21189  02-01-2007
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  »  New  The inflatable speakers dumping and no only...  Labyrinth?...  Audio Discussions  Forum     8  47108  05-30-2007
  »  New  Macondo's Axioms: Horn-loaded acoustic systems..  No wonder...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     72  393046  07-29-2007
  »  New  Attention Sound Engineers (compression and loudness)..  Injection channel and Romy's rules...  Playback Listening  Forum     48  214225  09-09-2007
  »  New  The Macondo’s Upper Bass Channel: what is next?..  Görlich again...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     30  190326  10-28-2007
  »  New  Wilson Audio and the Moore's law..  Sneak peak of modesty...  Audio News Forum     19  51278  04-26-2009
  »  New  Other Ways of getting Special Tone from a loudspeaker...  Paul S....  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     8  56934  11-27-2009
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  »  New  Superbly interesting effect: Suspended decoupled floor ..  Superbly interesting effect: Suspended decoupled floor ...  Playback Listening  Forum     0  12073  10-08-2010
06-02-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,130
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 176
Post ID: 23245
Reply to: 23244
Everything You Need?
Rather involved discussion about Helmholtz-type speakers.  Here's another proponent, Hans Kortenbach:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LHBlikzKoRg

I have only "heard" the Musical Affairs speakers on YouTube, but I have to say, they are able to do some specific things rather well.  As ever, the resonating oops question that stays with me is, what do we mean by "resonances".  If the aim is to add tonal color to a horn system, that might be different than adding sound effects to a direct driver or hybrid system.  In Romy's case the drivers he used to do it have been noted for tonal color, in and of themselves, even in free air.  By this I mean that they can reproduce a wide range of instrumental and vocal colors.  In any case, would there be a value to having the same colorations added to any and all music?  I suppose this is possible if the resonator adds something that is otherwise always missing; but that's the only reason for this I can think of as I type.  The Musical Affairs speakers do seem to have some predictable (for the genre) problems when they are asked to play music that strays out of their sweet spot.  Not that any other speakers are different in this regard, rather to say, to my ears the MA speakers have a fairly limited repertoire.  Do the "piano speakers" share these sorts of limits?

Also on the Bosendorfer site are a number of "options" offered for improving speaker performance.  These could be very educational for the patient, attentive audiophile.


Paul S
06-02-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
martinshorn
Germany
Posts 107
Joined on 04-14-2017

Post #: 177
Post ID: 23246
Reply to: 23245
What is with this youtube????
i noticed these videos / new fashion weeks ago and was wondering , wtf is that? Who would watch this and for which purpose? Does anyone????
Crazy world. Soon people will start saying "last month i went for vacation to lonely planet"
06-02-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,130
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 178
Post ID: 23247
Reply to: 23246
Yes, It Takes All Kinds
Yes, I agree, it is "wasting time" to look at websites, YouTube, go to shows, etc. to learn about hi-fi.

Best regards,
Paul S
06-02-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
martinshorn
Germany
Posts 107
Joined on 04-14-2017

Post #: 179
Post ID: 23248
Reply to: 23247
Calm
no offense buddy Smile just the youtube...
06-02-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,130
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 180
Post ID: 23249
Reply to: 23248
Am Besten?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34xSqNs5AQ0




12-12-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
martinshorn
Germany
Posts 107
Joined on 04-14-2017

Post #: 181
Post ID: 24599
Reply to: 23249
If you could start from the beginning...
Hi Romy 
you mentioned once somewhere, knowing upfront youd add the resonance channel, you had it all done different.What particularly you would make different in your system?  
cheers, Josh
12-12-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,495
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 182
Post ID: 24600
Reply to: 24599
What if….
Josh, this was an excellent question and I was asking myself the same question a lot during the different stages of my understanding of the Macondo architecture. I would not call it “resonance channel” but rather the “injection channel” as it not actually adds any resonances but we understand what the question implies. So, here is the thoughts that I have. If I design Macondo from scratch and knowing what I know how about employing the injection channel then I would make the following things different:   

1)      I would provide more prominent location for my Injection Channel, in vertically aligned position, probably between tweeter and fundamental channel. Probably I would put it in a tube, trying to keep the face footprint as low as possible.   
 
2)      I would spend less efforts on MF DSET as I feel that a proper selection of Injection Channel, driver might very might override the efforts over DHT of MF channel.   

3)      As I would know the dimension of my Injection Channel enclosure I would put the high pas filter in the Injection Channel amplifier. Even though my Injection Channel drives now my midbass there is no need to have a speak-level filter at midbass. The inner stage cap inside the Milq would do the duty perfectly fine, in addition protecting the Injection Channel OPT from any saturation of overpowering. 
   
Rgs,
Romy the Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
12-12-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
martinshorn
Germany
Posts 107
Joined on 04-14-2017

Post #: 183
Post ID: 24601
Reply to: 24600
In the middle???
Hi Romy  Im just trying to imagine that. If you got to keep the vertical offset small, between the ways, this would rip a hole in the middle, wouldnt it ?  Also bit surprising as i thought you liked the injector on the ground initially. 
I hope I understood correctly from your posts, a horizontal offset is a no go always for all channels? (would be convinient to put the injector on the side) 
Also a distance offset (traveling time from channel to ear, or as some may call it time alignment) is not possible? (would be convinient to put the injector behind the tweeters) 
Then not much left of options, only on the top, which is too high, in the middle it rips the channels apart. 
Last option, ground level, would elevate the fundamental channel to the very top, which is a dramatic loss of 6dB gain not to have the floor as a horn-mirror-boost...Im lost there.  cheers,Josh
12-13-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,495
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 184
Post ID: 24602
Reply to: 24601
I will do it when I have time.
I do not advocate injector on the ground. The way how I use my injector I high pass is aggressively, so the ground coupling is not a requirement. If somebody use injection at lower octaves then it might be a merit to do so but not in context of my injection. 
 
It is absolutely prohibitive in my view to have injection with arrival offset, the time aliment is absolutely mandatory. Now, there is very valid debatable question. If you for instance locate injection channel above the teeter then you have less tight vertical horns island. If you have the injection channel located on the side of the tweeter then you have more compact horns configuration but you introduce a horizontal offset and probably too much reflection from the tweeter.  What approach provides more damage to sound? I would have difficulty to answer this question. I did the vertical alignment and did not experiment with horizontal offset. The vertical alignment, since the injection has high output in top octaves, does damage imaging to a degree. Will this damage be more or less if I use horizontal offset? I do not have the answer. I bought 6 months back of so a coupe, of 10” tubes incisures and as I have time I was planning to put the 10” Tannoy in there and try it horizontally offset injectors. The problem is that I do not have now any good harness to hold it on my frame to assure a stable time positioning and time alignment. I will go for this when I have time.


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Page 8 of 8 (184 items) Select Pages:  « First ... « 4 5 6 7 8
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  The elusive “absolute tone”...  Breeze......  Playback Listening  Forum     24  152220  07-28-2005
  »  New  The “Primary Frequencies”...  Melody range and the other octaves...  Audio For Dummies ™  Forum     5  48793  09-08-2005
  »  New  Don't position speakers but create Sound in room...  Listener position...  Audio For Dummies ™  Forum     1  28184  06-19-2006
  »  New  Great Cello Concertos..  János Starker passed away...  Musical Discussions  Forum     21  136250  07-04-2006
  »  New  SPUnisation of Macondo: how to catch own testicals...  Who? (shades of the old "musical" vs. "a...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     1  21189  02-01-2007
  »  New  Tannoy Red 1960s: some sober reality..  The Summer Monitors?...  Audio Discussions  Forum     10  107287  02-15-2007
  »  New  The inflatable speakers dumping and no only...  Labyrinth?...  Audio Discussions  Forum     8  47108  05-30-2007
  »  New  Macondo's Axioms: Horn-loaded acoustic systems..  No wonder...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     72  393046  07-29-2007
  »  New  Attention Sound Engineers (compression and loudness)..  Injection channel and Romy's rules...  Playback Listening  Forum     48  214225  09-09-2007
  »  New  The Macondo’s Upper Bass Channel: what is next?..  Görlich again...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     30  190326  10-28-2007
  »  New  Wilson Audio and the Moore's law..  Sneak peak of modesty...  Audio News Forum     19  51278  04-26-2009
  »  New  Other Ways of getting Special Tone from a loudspeaker...  Paul S....  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     8  56934  11-27-2009
  »  New  How to play Bruckner Sound in Audio...  Being a pedagogical geniuses…...  Playback Listening  Forum     16  65590  06-15-2010
  »  New  An educational Eugenie’s installation...  Some more......  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     15  54076  07-15-2010
  »  New  Superbly interesting effect: Suspended decoupled floor ..  Superbly interesting effect: Suspended decoupled floor ...  Playback Listening  Forum     0  12073  10-08-2010
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