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  »  New  Do not touch that used tonearm!..  Tonearm running-in...  Audio For Dummies ™  Forum     7  82974  01-30-2007
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  »  New  FM and … cables…..  Cables as Sound Shapers...  Off Air Audio Forum     4  46009  04-15-2009
  »  New  The BEST bass cable?..  Dialectic biased cable....  Audio Discussions  Forum     4  45582  04-22-2011
04-29-2021 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
xandcg


Rio de Janeiro, BR.
Posts 218
Joined on 09-07-2014
Post #: 51
Post ID: 26141
Reply to: 26139
Pure Red Copper.
 N-set wrote:
IIRC, Viborg uses what they call red copper, which is probably red brass - a high Cu content brass, quite a bit harder than pure Cu. Visually and under a few strokes of a metal saw (I wanted to check if this is not a plating) behaves indeed like a 'hard copper'. I protect the surfaces I can reach using Paul's method (I 'hate' you for that Paul, takes so much time): jewellery polish (me by hand) - isoprop cleaning - dielectric grease (silicon based DC-4)


If Viborg is following the market standards and I think so, "Red Copper" or "Pure Red Copper" is Cu2O, the first stage of the Copper Oxide. But I don't remember of anything about red copper on Vigorg literature except, may be, on power cables.


Think for yourself, do not be sheep.
04-30-2021 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
N-set
Gdansk, Poland
Posts 617
Joined on 01-07-2006
Post #: 52
Post ID: 26142
Reply to: 26141
Don't really care much
Might be. Honestly I don't care until they sound good. In Paul's construction they do (thank you Paul!)


Cheers,
Jarek
04-30-2021 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,699
Joined on 10-12-2006
Post #: 53
Post ID: 26143
Reply to: 26140
Drama vs. Economics
Alex, whatever the standards and/or expectations are for steel plate for ship yards, customers for electrical connectors don't want them to start out corroded, starting at the wholesale/distributor level. So, manufacturers don't want an inventory of their finished products corroding, either, and they go out of their way to be sure this doesn't happen. I don't know the specifics of working with copper for the "hi-fi market", but it's easy to see there's not much in the way of pure copper connectors available, and I suppose this is because it's more profitable to work with and sell copper alloys ("eutectic" copper). Hard to believe there is a profitable yet un-tapped market for pure copper hi-fi connectors.


Best regards,
Paul S
11-28-2021 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
xandcg


Rio de Janeiro, BR.
Posts 218
Joined on 09-07-2014
Post #: 54
Post ID: 26587
Reply to: 26143
I give it up.
So, I give up of trying this cable construction experiment. I found some who already did a test with a similar construction and once a higher shielding material was placed it killed the cotton in oil magic, and it sounded like a "regular' shielded cable.

Thanks for the advise too.

Btw, Viborg has now pure solid silver power plugs.

E.g. http://www.viborgaudio.com/en/Product/a/chanpin/jianzhusheji/2021/0923/377.html


Think for yourself, do not be sheep.
07-29-2022 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
xandcg


Rio de Janeiro, BR.
Posts 218
Joined on 09-07-2014
Post #: 55
Post ID: 26840
Reply to: 26587
Signal Projects
A cable vendor that actually explain what they are doing... if that is BS or not, I can't tell.

https://signalprojects.com/technology/


Think for yourself, do not be sheep.
01-01-2025 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,699
Joined on 10-12-2006
Post #: 56
Post ID: 27857
Reply to: 26840
Degrees of Boring?
No sense letting this cable thread languish, if speaking of cables. I just want to qualify remarks I made about new cables I added in 2024, namely Moray James S/PDIF and Audio Sensibilities Impact phono cables, and I also want to get Bud Purvine off any metaphorical hook regarding his Litz cables. To start, I used the famous Belden Synapse S/PDIF for years. It is a very intelligent HF filter that is no-doubt a Godsend for many CD listeners. It is so good at what it does that probably everyone should at least try it. Anyway, I swapped that for Acoustic Revive S/PDIF after the most recent John Wright "upgrades" to my DAC, in order to get "more" from my CDs, and it worked fine. I sent the Belden to Wojtek in exchange for Polish Vodka... Since then, no surprise, tuning in to the Loudpeakers, I heard things I had not heard before, and part of my efforts at fine tuning involved dealing with system-specific issues via front-end cable swaps. For some time I have been of the mind that I do not want "personality" from certain parts, including those cables. I no longer want "life from my cables", as I get that from my sources, and all the cables need to do is pass it along. It is not the case for me that these cables are actors reading a script, rather I am to the point where I just want the information, and I will ruin it to my tastes with other system elements. I am actually happy with my idea of "boring cables" at this time. I can tell you, if they sucked the Life out, they would be gone in a heartbeat. I did not list these cables in this cable thread before because I am pretty sure that what I get from them is "system specific". As ever with cables, YMMV, and I call them "boring" to emphesize this point.

Paul S
01-01-2025 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 10,239
Joined on 05-28-2004
Post #: 57
Post ID: 27858
Reply to: 27857
It is exactly what I am talking about.
"I  used the famous Belden Synapse S/PDIF for years. It is a very intelligent HF filter that is no-doubt a Godsend for many CD listeners"

Yes that is the beast I was referring to. But here's what my "socialist" thinking kicks in. When they made this cable they had absolutely no idea what they did as is most of their consecutive digital cables were garbage. Your description said it acts as a very intelligent HF filter, in my view, absolutely accurate. It filters forever should not be there and let whatever need to be there to pass. Whatever was done there in terms of filtration literally cause no money. So, why somebody do not do research figure out how that Belkin cable does it and make all other digital cables to implement this functionality. Not to build super expensive zillion dollars cost visually looking like Gucci bag, cables which have absolutely no beneficial impact to listener, but they actually cable which work. It is so good that it should not be proprietary owned by Belkin because Belgium objectively does not use it anymore. Just find the reason why it works the way how it works and elevate general standards of digital cable quality to this level. That is how my mind is working and I have no idea why the industry doesn't do it.

"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
01-01-2025 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 10,239
Joined on 05-28-2004
Post #: 58
Post ID: 27859
Reply to: 26840
Those explanations are irrelevant.
 xandcg wrote:
A cable vendor that actually explain what they are doing... if that is BS or not, I can't tell.

https://signalprojects.com/technology/
Actually I am not very satisfied with those explanations. Even though from physics and electrical prospective they are trying to do right things but how their Rochester's has very applied and very tangible benefit to a listening practice. I did not see any single attempt for them to build a bridge between specific electric parameter and how it impacts to sound. In my view that is absolutely key for any honest technology presentation in audio. You can spend incredible amount efforts to describe how accurate ingredients of a drink made. Still, in one way it might be a beautiful cocktail or in other case it's might be just a poison.

"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
01-01-2025 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,699
Joined on 10-12-2006
Post #: 59
Post ID: 27860
Reply to: 27858
Business As Usual vs. Choose By Ear
The very reason I posted about "Accidental Success" (in Playback Listening) is recognition of and resignation about the fact that audio components are generally not developed through high-demands listening, and those that seem to be so developed are severally limited (to my ears). In the case of front ends, I started making mine "harder" and harder years ago, until I was dealing with TMI (too much information), then I tried different ways to get all the information to "work", meaning "all the parts contribute to my Musical insight", without rounding things off. There is a big downside to this approach, namely that recordings sound like recordings, and - as we all know - not all recording are "good". There was a lot of tweaking over many years to get things to the point where I could get more Music than sound, per se, and "tricks" included for a while selecting parts that seemed not to expedite or hinder sounds, particularly Music, but they just passed it on. We are all stuck with parts that have very specific jobs to do, and specs are not nothing where this is concerned. In the end, i think it is well to have paid attention to things as I heard them, as I grew my system. It's hard for me to imagine commodifying anything I have done, if only because of all the time it's taken me. But I agree with Romy that "someone" with the manufacturing capabilities "ought to be able to" build on success via reverse engineering, if nothing else. Are there manufacturers with evolved listening skills based on evolved Musical appreciation that are consistently churning out great sounding, edge-of-the-art components? Off hand, I can't think of any...

Paul S
01-02-2025 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 10,239
Joined on 05-28-2004
Post #: 60
Post ID: 27862
Reply to: 27860
This is how it typically works.
The way it typically works is the following. Belkin most likely does not produce its own cables but gets them from other manufacturers. So, any “civilized” High-End audio entrepreneur would do the following:

Figure out where Belkin sources the Synapse cable and order 10 miles of it for probably $.99 a foot. It would cost a few more sense per foot to do the custom labeling of the cable “Digital Spring Dream”. Then meet with one of the contemporary audio reviewers and proposer to lend him $100K for 20% a year interest to set up a sweatshop with a dozen $10 per hour illegals that would cat the cable and terminate them. The audio reviewer published his typical idiocy in one of the leading publications claiming it was a very lucky event as the US government declassified the noise suppression ceremony used on M142 HIMARS and the retired service owner of “Digital Spring Dream” company used it to design his cables. Now the “Digital Spring Dream” cable costs $2,499 per meter. Then the owner of the “Digital Spring Dream” unleashes his little private army of online intellectuals-morons who jump to different websites (whatsbest and many similar) where posters receiving 75% off for the cable describe their orgasmic experiences from listening to this cable. As the noise picked up, the owner paid $50K to Robb Report for some product placement. As the owner of the “Digital Spring Dream” recognizes that his stash of the cable running out and the company who made it is not there anymore. He has two options: Continue to sell completely different cables under the “Digital Spring Dream”  name (thankfully the audio Morons will not know the difference) or discover the new product. The reviewer and his pack of online “intellectuals”  encouraged the owner to release any other cable for half-price under the name “Digital Spring Dream Jr”. This train was never late.

"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Page 3 of 3 (60 items) Select Pages:  « 1 2 3
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  Do not touch that used tonearm!..  Tonearm running-in...  Audio For Dummies ™  Forum     7  82974  01-30-2007
  »  New  Any good sounding AES/EBU interfaces out there?..  Better keep with AN cables...  Didital Things  Forum     53  434353  09-17-2007
  »  New  Purist Audio Design vs. Purist Audio Design..  Maybe we need phantom power?...  Audio Discussions  Forum     25  236897  04-06-2008
  »  New  The “Wet and Fuzzy” cable...  The “Wet and Fuzzy” cable....  Audio Discussions  Forum     0  15922  05-09-2008
  »  New  Cable Current Loading..  The Purist’s Problems...  Audio Discussions  Forum     5  37564  05-14-2008
  »  New  Chasing utopian better phono interconnect...  Did I miss something?...  Analog Playback Forum     6  111781  06-05-2008
  »  New  FM and … cables…..  Cables as Sound Shapers...  Off Air Audio Forum     4  46009  04-15-2009
  »  New  The BEST bass cable?..  Dialectic biased cable....  Audio Discussions  Forum     4  45582  04-22-2011
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