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05-23-2024 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 10,074
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 26
Post ID: 27400
Reply to: 27399
Of course I did
Yes, sure. I wrote about it quite a lot at my website. In fact most of the large Wilsons that I heard where driven by ML2s...


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-23-2024 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Newtohorn
Posts 13
Joined on 01-03-2018

Post #: 27
Post ID: 27401
Reply to: 27400
Biamp?
 Romy the Cat wrote:
Yes, sure. I wrote about it quite a lot at my website. In fact most of the large Wilsons that I heard where driven by ML2s...

in biamp configuration (x4 ml2s)?
05-23-2024 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 10,074
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 28
Post ID: 27402
Reply to: 27401
All the same....
Yes, in bi-amp as well; which is not the best topological solution. Newtohorn, if you do not mind, try to use posting at this forum, not as a chat style, and to express yours in complete thoughts.


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-23-2024 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Newtohorn
Posts 13
Joined on 01-03-2018

Post #: 29
Post ID: 27403
Reply to: 27402
Too brief
Sorry for being too brief in my post.  The reason for my question on ml2/grand slam - many years back I heard the grand slamm driven by a pair of lamm amp.  I did not pay attention to the model back then but it was either the single ended ml2 or the pp ml1.  My focus was on the sound generated by the grand slamm.  It was superb - nuance, delicate, definition, all there at moderate level.  The Alexandria s2 was already out back then and I was trying to fine tune it in my friends system without success.  I came to conclusion that the grand slamm was a better speaker and for a while was looking for a pair.  In hindsight perhaps it was the lamm/grand slamm combo.  Too bad I did not pay attention if it was ml1 or ml2, and if it was ml2 - how would 2 pairs of them sound in Biamp config.
05-23-2024 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 10,074
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 30
Post ID: 27404
Reply to: 27403
I have written about it years ago
 Yes, I am familiar with “large Wilsons,” starting with Grand Slam and up. Since I have long had 4 ML2s and bumped with them, the bumping configuration of large Wilsons has always interested me. I do not like the smaller Wilsons, but the large Wilsons are remarkable in terms of sound reproduction. I wrote about it years back in my Wilson's Thread, but here is a brief summary. You for sure want to drive the top of large Wilsons by ML2; you simply will not find any better amplifiers out there. It should be the production before ~2004-2005 as then ML2s were not good anymore. ML2s are slightly lazy in terms of dynamics, and here is when super contrasty large Wilsons do a very good job and the very excessive prose that Wilson ask for them is very much justified in my view as large Wilson's are unique and accomplish many things that no other speakers can.  When we go to Wilson's bass, then, it is a very different story. It is wonderful for a single box, but it is topological dishonesty. Per the investment of a pair of large Wilsons and a pair of good-sounding amps to drive them, the bass that you can get out of them is not worth it. You might have an incredibly lucky room and with this proper positioning of the speakers you might have a very decent result, but it is a rarity. Still, no matter what you do, the quality of base you can get from large Wilson’s not on a pair of quality of higher range might get from large Wilsons and vintage ML2. Trust me, Wilson's know it, and they are perfectly capable of making the right decisions by selling products, the SCUs that the idiot-reviewers will move from storage facilities to UPS. ML2 is not a good amplifier to drive large Wilsons at the bottom. ML1 is not even remotely matching of quality of bass to ML2. ML2 uses indirectly heated output tube which cannot work with plate current and after you get 18 watts it drops dead instantaneously. To drive Wilson base you need to have if not solid state (which mostly never does bass properly) but something like ML3. The matter here is not in absolute power but an ability on amplifier very gently to enter plate current mode and force the power when Wilson’s port begins to create noise. I have never heard of ML3 in a situation where I would be in the position to express my opinion about it, particularly about its bass. I have a lot of concerns at ML3 came after they reduce expressivity of post 2004 ML2. I also have some designed disagreement with ML3, for his creme de la creme I feel alarm could go for more sophisticated solution what he did in ML3.  


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
05-24-2024 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Amir
Iran Tehran
Posts 302
Joined on 02-11-2009

Post #: 31
Post ID: 27405
Reply to: 27403
Wilson subwoofer
If Lamm ML2 is not enough good for bass you can use crossover and add a wilson passive subwoofer.
Lamm ML2 will do his job better if you use a high power amplifier for wilson subwoofers.
this approach will also reduce the Port noise of wilson alexandria.
05-24-2024 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 10,074
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 32
Post ID: 27406
Reply to: 27405
That is not enough efforts in this direction.

Yes, the ide do not let large Wilson's to go down let's say 40 cycles is probably what I would do if I own those speakers.. I would probably plug the port, and if necessary change the base driver. My point is that you need to be absolutely insane if you go for Wilson's expense and to do to experiment how to get the sounds that you want outside of what Wilson offers. Did you see any person out there whoever tried to work with a large Wilson base? I didn't. Also, do not discard Wilson and they are not stupid and they know what they do. They do not sell sound they sell products. Pay attention how they position their subwoofers. None of them are sealed, instead they are ported and tune to use at the bottom of full range large Wilson speakers. Soon a or later or ported designs sounds the same producing absolutely identical port noise. I was listening yesterday a guy demonstrate please play back at YouTube and he was playing third movement of Tchaikovsky six. She use vintage large JBL and all double bass play literally the same note. In my book it is extremely annoying. 


Now, if you have large Wilson's and drive it with old ml2, and you are willing to discard anything that come from Wilson's under 40 cycles then you are in very good shape. Now you need to find a solution and it might be only infinite Buffle or sealed topology, that will do lower base. Then you need to find amplification and crossivering solution for this. If I were in those shoes and need it ready to go product then I will look for Dunlavy TWS-6 product or something similar. Obviously to drive those monsters would be a problem and if you insist to stay in Lamm wold then M1.1 might be a good choice to start. Nowadays nobody produce those solutions out of box and there's a reason for this as the people who do it seriously understands that it is very specific to the any given room and there is no way to abstract it to are ready to go product. Again you can use anything of the shelf to compliment Wilson's at the bottom but whatever I seen so far would not be and the level of large Wilson/ML2 midrange combination.


Unfortunately anything good person that I've seen who have large Wilsons so devoted to the products and never pursue any personal objectives, or even have any.




"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Page 2 of 2 (32 items) Select Pages:  « 1 2
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  Macondo 3.0..  Toilet Paper...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     51  28838  06-21-2023
  »  New  Macondo’s Midbass Project – the grown up time...  Vitavox 15/40...  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     455  2886110  05-20-2010
  »  New  Macondo's Axioms: Horn-loaded acoustic systems..  A link to another thread....  Horn-Loaded Speakers Forum     120  653689  07-29-2007
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