How about the 4" Fostex FE108E? http://www.madisound.com/catalog/index.php?manufacturers_id=131&sort=3a&page=1 

It's only too big by 0.080", and if that bothers you, it would be easy to chuck by the magnet, & turn that off the diameter of front basket.  
Even on a slight bevel with a radius to look nice, then black it again and it wouldn't even show. 

It would be in the same family of sound as FE108ES II which I find to be great between 300 - 8000 Hz.  
You might be able to hear them somewhere?
Robert

There is an announcement in the new Hobby Hifi:

Expolinear is going to distribute Görlich drivers. Old price, half of the current elite Car audio stuff, and probably 8 Ohm. 13 and 17 cm will be available with rubber, foam and cloth surround, 20 and 25 cm only with rubber surround.

I am quite fascinated with the result that I might get from MiniME and at the same time I am defensive with the direction it takes. Anyhow, here is how it stands…

The decision to go for MF driver was I think right one. Even the 70-20RX tweeter has some “tools” that enable it to work more of less confidently in MF but I never exited about tonal capacity of ribbons. Also, I would like to make MiniME to be able to play loud and with less compression and therefore I would need some headroom between the lower knee of drivers and their crossover point. So, the 3-way with a good band-pass MF driver is a reasonable, I guess, direction to look, even though I might use MF not as independent channel but rather as pedalpoint for tweeter to woofer WITH the woofers, not to fulfill the gap evenly between LF and HF but rather to help to the ribbon and bass driver to care MF.

A guy who read my site sent me to try the JBL-5-2. I always liked those drivers however; I knew LE-8 and never tried the JBL-5. Playing with JBL-5-2 I figure out that it might be exactly what I need. It has 95dB sensitively. It has the right tonal nobility and it is small. The driver is slightly less dynamic then LE-8 when crosses at the same frequency of 1000Hz. I made a number of experiments with it and end up listening the JBL-5-2 with 25uf cap. That makes approximately 800Hz crossover point. It is possible to drive LE5 lower but then at higher volumes the driver gets compression sooner. Ironically the HF section of the driver is falling apart faster with higher volume. So, I was roiling it off and off and end up with and 0.31mH coil, that makes approximately 4000 crossover point. In fact rolling it even lower sounds more right to me, probably down to 1-2K. All together JBL LE5-2 in 800Hz-4000Hz region the LE5-2 do OK, not perfect but OK. I bought the JBL 2105 – the pro version – I might sound different – who knows…

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=5706

There are 3 things that attract me in JBL LE5-2 driver – the sensitivity, some tonal qualities (not overly thrilling but better then others) and the absence of the thing that annoy me. I mean the JBL LE5-2 is quite neutral driver in term of character, partiality and bias – this is important for me as I would like do not deal with it in this loudspeaker. It is possible that there are more capable 4-5” MF drivers then LE5/2105. I spoke with a number of people who proposed to me different solutions. For instance the sound like knowledgeable guy from Planet 10

http://www.planet10-hifi.com/

…proposed a number of Fostex solutions.  I do not know - I have seen so much negative result from Fostex side (perhaps improperly implanted) that it makes me prejudicial… From what I have seen the Fostex always loose correlation with sounds when volume goes up. The Fostex-like drivers might work in sever high-pass through, but the 6dB-7dB sensitively is not nothing.  I wonder what would be the new Görlich sensitive, the old one were at 87dB…

So, I have the tweeter, I have the MF driver, I will have my Malaysian woofers. The LE5 is 95dB sensitive the Malaysian woofers are 90.5dB at 1000Hz. The 4 of the woofers would do +6dB that would be just slightly above LE5-2. In addition it will be in array that would make it integrateable at 1-2 db higher. The RAAL 70-20RX is 93-94dB but 96-97dB effectively. That would make the target sensitively of the entire speaker somewhere around 96dB, here and there…

What however, bother me in this idea is that introduction of MF screw up my entire idea of the MiniMe’s simplicity. The 5” thin and straightforward tower with a few brasses is becoming just a dream. The MF driver shell sit at more or less ears level, the tweeter might be above. However, the MF driver needs to be isolated from the pressure of LF drivers, I was trying to use a back change on JBL and I did not like it. So, the speaker shell have sections and waste some volume of the effective speaker height - I do not want to make it too tall.  So, the complexity of the enclosure increases and at this point I do not think that my regular machinist would be able to do it at cost-effective fashion. I am not going to do any enclosure work myself, so it might need lead to bringing some speaker-building specialist to help. Thos guys use wood and wood would bring thickness – bye-bye the 5” front baffle… perhaps I need to make it with ¼ steal sheets and forget about it? I do not know at this point. It is become more complex then I would like it to be… Does anyone who read this know any machinist from New England who would LIKE to build loudspeakers (send me emial if you do).  I am afraid that my machinist when I drown for him all those steal or G10 labyrinths and sections would sent me to hell.

Actually it is very possible that it might be so. I made some rudimental measurements and concluded that RAAL tweeter and JBL midrange mounted in the same baffle has non-perfect time aliment. So, I will need to use gaskets under the drivers to time-align them and it is all keeping the speaker sealed.  Hmmmm, too mach hustle…

Then I thought: the tweeter is sealed and does not care about the box. The MF driver crossed at 700-800Hz does not really care about box as with a small even not-sealed enclosure it already acts as an infinite baffle. So, what not to put the MF and HF drivers in a separate “Island” that would be sitting atop of the main LF section, similar to what Parsifal or small Wilson do? The upper frequency “Island” might be small, with no demands to resonance control, and might use a very thin material, like 1/8 of G10 or the similar. I might not even close the back side of the thing… This would make the entire box design very simple and would enable an easy access to the drivers for time alignment.

MiniMe is growing up...

It is a shame that you will not be able to utilize the ringy dustcap that the origional drivers have, but the JBL LE5-2 driver is quite nice and should not bring many surprises.

Yep, thanks.

I still do not know why you feel that I will not exploit the “ringy dustcaps” on the Malaysian bass drivers; in fact I never gave up on this idea. I preliminary concluded that my MF channel might not go lower then 700Hz but I did not say what will be the upper limit of my woofers. At this point I have no idea now my MF will behave in infinitely baffle incisures, how the channel will be jointed, if the JBL drivers and the Malaysian driver will be able to play together and if they do then how will they overlap. IF the Malaysian array at their upper knee will be able to embraces the TTH characteristic of LE-5, and wise versa….

http://www.goodsoundclub.com/Forums/ShowPost.aspx?postID=5874

… then only God know where I will be able to cross them. The common rules suggest that with first order the overlap between the drivers too large anyhow (lobbing and other issuers…). It is right in theory but in practice it is all baloney and I discard it. If the right drivers are very much time-aliened then it is fine for them to play together and to cover the same range. My thought about it was the reason why in my last drawing I made the “MF Island” not with semi-diamond shape (better for imaging) but rectangular. It was gone because it allows me to flip the “Island” unsaid down, extending inclusion of the MF driver into the Malaysian’s array…

In inversing tweeter, spent some time listing it. It has at 93dB 6.8R and .63mH. The inductance  is too high for my application, so I would need to shunt primary with one more coil to drive inductance   down. I recognize only Bessel curve and it would be:

4kHz – 3.6uF -.43mH
5kHz – 2.9uF -.35mH
6kHz – 2.4uF -.29mH
7kHz – 2.1uF -.25mH

I was driving it up and down and as I expected the higher I cross it the better result was. It is not sound to my likening below 3K but at 6K-7K it is very nice. I think it is where I might end up using it. I did not drive the 70-20RX along with JBL LE5-2 yet – I need some kind of frame to mount them. I do not think that I will be doing it at this point… It looks like it might turn out to be an interesting upper frequency section.  Let hope that LE5 would have enough “colors” to shine through the RAAL’s neutrality. Well, from another side – the LE5 are cheap and I might experiment to soak in cone with kind of chitin or floor polishing… I can see it coming and I sell next CES the drivers that were pre-treated by boiling in collected sputter of adolescent camel.

I came across to a new to me very interesting driver: Scan- Speak Illuminator.

http://www.tymphany.com/15wu_8741t00

it looks like it is new for them as well and it might be very interesting. It is around 84dB, to get any more or less reasonable sensitivity it is necessary to have 6 of them. They are at $230 each- pricy for 12 drivers.  Still it might be interesting. I am not planning to use of for MiniMe – it already way beyond what I need but the opportunity that the Illuminator offers are inspiring.  I am concerned that they do not provide the length of gap and max exertion- the under-hung motor is good  but how far? Anyhow, the Scan- Speak knows what they do and it might be very interesting driver for a MiniMe-like projects. Now, when they will do the 2.5” exertion in full under-hung mode only 18-inchers?

It may be good, though i've worried about SS since Tymphany took over.  I have seen many good companies with good products completely screwed by new management.  Their re-packageing of Peerless into V-Line (or whatever the hell that was) speaks of marketing moronism especially.  The motors they are using on the Illuminators look quite good...neodymium magnets will probably become more and more popular in these type products and perhaps justifiably so.

I found these a few days ago...https://www.solen.ca/pdf/atd/14w2608agti.pdf

Lbjefferies7 wrote:

I found these a few days ago...https://www.solen.ca/pdf/atd/14w2608agti.pdfAny experience or speculation about these drivers?

Why I said that Görlich sounded “different” and were used wrongly. Well, it was the low resonant frequency that I think screw those drivers. It was around 60Hz for small driver and it lead people to use Görlich in 2-ways configuration. Magico monitor was a perfect example of 2-way miss-use, listen them and you will hear what I mean. As good Görlich was at strictly midrange (with some questionable tone) as dead it was when a driver was forced to care lower MF and upper bass. Görlich is excellent MF driver but why drivers that shell work above 300Hz shell have a resonant frequency of 50Hz? Well, those mislead many people. What I experimented with my Görlich I did the same mistake and I drove them to low. I did have a chance however to hear 3 way implementation with Podzus’s  Görlich. It was a small Italian company, I do not remember name, and the made a floor standing 3-way loudspeakers with Zellatron’s version of Görlich drivers. It was ported Scan-Speak twin bass with, one MF Görlich and one Heil transducer for HF. They were presented at CES sometimes in 2000 and it was the “lost show” for them. They were in some kind of side room and no one spoke English among those guys, they play crappy music. The hi-fi show in other words. The speakers were set up strangely with very surprisingly good MF. I was attracted to it and a friend of mine and I were articulated something to those Italians. I do not remember already how it was, but I remember that I was bitching about the very inappropriate bass – it was obviously that their if not mistaken 300B amp was not able to handle the port’s secondary resonance, the current resonance.  Those Italians somehow understood us and told us that they have a solution for this problem, inviting us to stop by in the end of the day when they might to show off “another amps”. We stopped by, I think after hours, and they indeed had a pair of gorgeous looking monoblocks with 211 tubes of their own made, it was not demod at the show. However the sound of those thighs was nothing short of wonderful. I literally had no bases for complain. Regardless to the fact that it was 8 years back and I was much less intelligent about sound and much less critical that I now I still feel that it was very good. The sad part that no one ever mention about that company after then but those Italians  truly knew what they were doing.

I presume that if Görlich would do 5 then I might try them for MiniMe in 3-way configuration but the sensitively of 87dB is relay keep all of it out of the ball park. Even two of them would be far from my targeted 95dB… I presume that if Görlich stay with 100Hz-130Hz primary resonance then they would have fewer excursions and pick 5-6dB of sensitivity. Then they would need to stiff up the suspension it will be better for MF but it will be a different driver as no one knows how the Görlich’s cone would sound hard-suspended.

Lbjefferies7 wrote:

… I am going to revise my "Mini" speakers for a second system (different location) and I have not decided how serious they should be.

I too have no respect for DIY'ers of any type, and audio is certainly the worst place for such people.  I don't identify with or socialize among such people, or even audiophiles in general.  The only thing that motivates most of these people seems to be the fear that someone might either have a bigger income or a bigger dick.  When I think of DIY "speaker" builders, I can just see some worn-out Al Bundy look-alike in his garage cobbling together some piece of crap just hoping that it will impress/piss-off the neighbors when he plays Ted Nugent.  And he wants to talk to me about audio.  Perfect.

My interest is music.  I intentionally avoid commercial speakers that profess to be high-end.  I have heard exactly two "audiophile" playback systems for a total of maybe 5 minutes (some custom full-range planer speakers and Dynaudio Evidence, Classe, Nordost, grinning salesman system) and was unimpressed with the fact that neither of them played music in a significant way.  Audio was there, but no music.  Because I grew up in an environment of live, Real Music, working dilignetly to use sound of Real Instruments (pianos), I involved myself in the idea of loudspeakers as musical instruments.  I can no longer listen seriously with any other human being present.  Trying to explain my system to others has become impossible (for me, at least) and I know that everyone I know will probably never understand.  Music disappears when they are around and the entire effect becomes silly and frivolous...even though they say "it's great."

So here I am at the Tabula Rasa Loudspeaker University, not jerking off other people with sound and music...just myself.  The right music is perhaps the most rewarding and stimulating experience I will ever have.  An experience that is all mine, and only mine.

Now let's go discuss cable elevators!!!

Do you European guys know anything about this German company?

http://www.micro-precision.eu/index.html

It looks like they have new production of Görlich drivers and it looks like they use aluminum.  It looks like they do it for automobiles, which is fine.

The series Z look attractive:

http://www.micro-precision.eu/6.html

 and they have 4 sizes of Görlich drivers. Could somebody learn what is the sensitivity of this driver:

http://www.micro-precision.eu/7.html

I was thinking and thing about it and eventually the amount of garbage thrown around my room was overwhelming and the only solution was to put all that garbage in trash or into some kind enclosure. Well, I decided the later and the MiniMe project is on it’s way. So, 3 days back I met my machinist and gave him all drowning of MineMe, placing the order. Since I finally went for G10 material it will take for a while – perhaps 2-3 weeks to have it done. Ok, I am not in hurry…

I decided to use juts one port and it will be 2” post, if I target 40Hz then it will be not too long pipe – approximately 3-4 inch. I will be using doable-flared port made from ABS. What inters me is if the port flare and the port’s pipe need to be mass-loaded or something like this? The pipe and the flare will care quite strong back and force reaction, so why do not make it from heavier mater then just flimsy ABS? Sure I will not re-do the port from bronze but I wonder if it makes sense to beef up the port, wrapping up some wavy staffing among it. I have quite good result from past what I was calming down horns by wrapping belts around them inner-layered with lead. Does it make sense to use the same techniques for the plastic elements of port?

There is a test of the 17 cm Görlich with rubber surrond in the new Hobby Hifi.

Very low fs (23 Hz) and low sensitivity (86 db). There is a clear surround resonance, so maybe it would be wise to wait for the announced models with cloth or foam surround. The membrane material seems to be really unique: The diaphragm has a resonance at 4-5 kHz that is also clearly visible in the distortion curves, but it is dead after 1 ms! BTW: It is a hard foam and the aluminium foils are just covers that are necessary because it is open pore.

There is also a test of the cheaper brother of the Magico Mini´s fancy looking midwoofer. It has a carbon/kevlar mesh diaphragm. The very low Rms indicates a low loss rubber surround, but is lacking surrond resonances. In the upper midrange the CSD is slower that the Görlich´s, however. From the distortion figures I don´t believe there can be anything wrong when used properly (as midrange!). Personally I have listened to the Veravox 5 highpassed with Shindo electronics, and I couldn´t find any tonal error, so I believe ATD definitely CAN build good drivers.

Jeeze, I just mention G10 and every machinist out there wants my head delivered to them on a silver platter!  Diamond tooling does help but I'll have to ask the guys I know with waterjet cutters if they have had any problems with it.  I'd think that would be pretty painless.  I would normally mention 3M ScotchWeld 2216 B/A as an adheasive, but I don't know how pissed everyone would get

Good Luck and Happy New Year