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   Home » Analog Playback» The last phonocorrector: “End of Life" Phonostage (285 posts, 14 pages)
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  »  New  Where are our good phonostages?..  Omnigon Tubes...  Analog Playback Forum     61  439958  05-31-2004
  »  New  The Expressive Technologies SU-1..  “too bright” or “resolution” or “details” with SUT prim...  Analog Playback Forum     33  263520  12-30-2004
  »  New  EAR 834P Modification Guide..  Copper air caps...  Analog Playback Forum     38  420924  02-09-2006
  »  New  My Analog Playback: the fat lady has sung..  My analog setup update....  Analog Playback Forum     9  83974  04-04-2006
  »  New  Phono stages with SU-1..  SU-1...  Analog Playback Forum     4  45964  11-23-2007
  »  New  Chasing utopian better phono interconnect...  Did I miss something?...  Analog Playback Forum     6  78906  06-05-2008
  »  New  Buying a last cartridge...  Lucky you...  Analog Playback Forum     80  564851  09-05-2008
  »  New  EAR 834P mods..  Copper air caps...  Analog Playback Forum     38  420924  11-04-2008
  »  New  AMR PH-77: just another phonostage or more?..  Oh, yeah... the sound of the Thing Itself......  Analog Playback Forum     11  86999  07-05-2009
  »  New  An interesting Russian pnonocorrector...  Uber-tweeky phono topologies deconstructed...  Analog Playback Forum     9  57032  03-01-2010
  »  New  Expressive Technologies SU-1 and cartridge output and i..  MV and Ohms...  Analog Playback Forum     2  20392  07-07-2011
  »  New  How to run MM-type cartridge into MC phonostage?..  Quite interesting....  Analog Playback Forum     6  39220  11-13-2011
  »  New  The tales of two phonostages: Allnic and 834PT...  The tales of two phonostages: Allnic and 834PT....  Analog Playback Forum     0  14638  12-21-2011
06-15-2015 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
rogier
Posts 12
Joined on 11-16-2006

Post #: 276
Post ID: 21709
Reply to: 21707
Copyright air-cap RIAA...
fiogf49gjkf0d
hopefully building an air-cap phonostage doesn't get prohibited.., i 've built one too, this time with a different tube and values but the same principle (in Miller-capacity)

With kind regards, rogier
06-16-2015 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,545
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 277
Post ID: 21710
Reply to: 21707
It is what it is.
fiogf49gjkf0d
Well, below is the email that I got from the man. I feel that he is diagnosable. I am not the Doctor House but I have been insisting for years that any person who spent proficiently in Audio Industry some time is fully diagnosable. 
 
On Thursday, August 29, 2013, EARYOSHINO wrote:
Sir, it has been brought to my attention your pontification articles hijacking and trying to profess that the EAR834P was a "SkinFlint" your quotes design. I suggest that if one had put all these fancy components in, would the public pay say £7K for a unit?  It also appalled me some of the ignorence about capacitors. Mica have lots of problems that is why I use polystyrene. I did a lot of work on capacitors in the early 70's in Japan to substantiate my choice of components. I have seen a variation of your so called mods on a Chinese product. Wonderful. I call it intellectual deprivation. You also made mention of my transformers by Stevens & Billington. To suggest you can buy them out the back door? They were and still are my propriotry designs that the information on how to make and wind were taught to him. He has had 25 years of exclusive knowledge from me. Your objectives please tell me? Make money of my back?
 



"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
06-16-2015 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,157
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 278
Post ID: 21711
Reply to: 21710
I Guess We Just Don't Understand Economics
fiogf49gjkf0d
Not long ago I made an online remrark about a deluxe/"flexible" phonostage, opining that I would rather have mm-only gain and fixed input R, since I use a SUT, and I don't want the extra circuitry idling in the background. The manufacturer responded privately, very politely, saying, yes, that would be optimal, but they need to sell the phono stages. Since this is a manufacturer that sells "directly", I guess the "economic issues" brought up by TdP are pretty much "universal" for manufacturers.


Paul S
06-16-2015 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
steverino
Posts 302
Joined on 05-23-2009

Post #: 279
Post ID: 21712
Reply to: 21710
Gray market
fiogf49gjkf0d
Romy,

It is possible that he is concerned about people in the big Asian country near Japan taking these various ideas and producing knockoffs or even worse upgrades to his basic design. It is revealing that he says "intellectual deprivation" rather than some more legalistic term. Also it is revealing that he references the early 70s for his study of capacitors. He seems to be admitting he has not done any recent work.

Here is a short quote from a Stereophile interview with Tim deP:

De Paravicini: Initially, at about the age of 13, I started constructing them from articles in the hobbyist magazines. Since I couldn't afford to buy all the parts I needed, they had to be stripped from old radios and televisions from scrap yards. My frustration at the performance of those construction projects forced me to look at their design. I ended up having to try and be innovative, starting from square one to come up with my own improved design.

Well what goes around comes around. But I can understand if he fears someone trying to directly profit from a knockoff. It doesn't seem that he is accusing you of that; merely making ideas about improvements more widely known.
06-17-2015 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Wojtek
Pinckney (MI), United States
Posts 159
Joined on 09-01-2005

Post #: 280
Post ID: 21715
Reply to: 21712
Mix up
fiogf49gjkf0d
I guess Thorsten is laughing since he should be the main receiver of TdP email. Popularity of a product is a double bladed sword.  I do hope that sales of EAR 834 phono stage increased notably after Romy decided to make that circuit into his "end of life phonostage". I read many references regarding that unit on second hand market and it's qualities pointing to  lengthy saga on GoodSoundClub and Thorsten's musings.I also bought my used 834P on the promise that " 99% of analog users don't really need a better phonostage than EAR" and I sort of agree. Surely, I did make my own version with fancy caps and parts but looking from a perspective I consider that effort a waste of time and money. Stock circuit is "good enough for who it is for" although better not to look what's inside .I don't think the whole basic unit has more than $25 worth of wholesale material cost including the case and this may partially explain Tim's outburst. There may be a market pressures to increase the quality of components caused by multiple modification threads on internet. It kind of forces him to increase quality while he can't rise the price due to spread of phonostages  available now a days Tough choices for UK based manufacturer.
06-17-2015 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,545
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 281
Post ID: 21716
Reply to: 21715
The Thorsten’s mark.
fiogf49gjkf0d

Yes, Thorsten was the man that made the initial modification in the EAR 834 and I need to note that it was not redesign of any kind but juts basic modifications and admitting the unnecessary things. Even though Thorsten is the industry person he did not play any game sand posted his write up open and public. My contribution to the projects was supplementing the EAR 834PT (“T” comes from Thorsten) with no dielectric capacitors (air caps) and bounding it with ET-2 transformer that make great phonostage to be “End of the Life” phonostage. I do not particularly care about my priority in this process as I do audio for MYSELF. All of those industry idiots do not get that for a person who does audio excessively for own needs all their stupid self-pomposity is very much irrelevant and their pretentiousness screaming is just a noise to me.

Still, do not discard behind the stupid TdP behavior the elegance of 834 TdP’s design and the quality of 834’s sound. > >




"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
01-30-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
N-set
Gdansk, Poland
Posts 454
Joined on 01-07-2006

Post #: 282
Post ID: 22933
Reply to: 16916
Sound beats engeneering
 Romy the Cat wrote:
fiogf49gjkf0d1)   

3)      The common mode filter you have at the PS’s input- why do you use them? They do eat some dynamics. As many time I removed them from all imaginary components as many time I witnessed better sound.



After a long break I'm slowly comming back to my system. Only now I've found the time to check that and I must agree with Romy: Removing CM filters, MOVs, arresters the rest of the engeneering crap (apart from the hour meter) from the power lines has cleaned the sound, its more emotionally involving, direct, the dynamical contrast does seem better. The change was rather subtle but noticeabe, in a bit similar direction as my experiments with vibration decoupling- some subtle veil got removed.

Cheers,
Jarek



Cheers,
Jarek
01-30-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Paul S
San Diego, California, USA
Posts 2,157
Joined on 10-12-2006

Post #: 283
Post ID: 22935
Reply to: 22933
Engineering Crap
Yes, an ongoing theme here at GSC: If it sounds good, it is good.  Conversely, no matter the "logic", and no matter the "technical genius" or "technological breakthroughs", if it sounds bad, it is bad. Likewise with any sort of "logic" or "intuition" that is not actually borne out by acceptable sound: it is not good.  The problem with the empirical/subjective method for audio is mainly time/money, also the Big Problem that the listener's tastes are required to make the judgement calls in the first place. Of course, this is antithetical to most engineer's ideas about who they are and what they and their ilk stand for; hence the discussions on their forums vs. here at GSC.

Best regards,
Paul S
01-30-2017 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
N-set
Gdansk, Poland
Posts 454
Joined on 01-07-2006

Post #: 284
Post ID: 22936
Reply to: 22935
Its not that it sounds "better"
it's more similar to removing say some delicate wool from your ears. I guess some recordings benefited from a bit of the veil but then its a problem of the recording.

 Paul S wrote:
also the Big Problem that the listener's tastes are required to make the judgement calls in the first place.


In this case I hear an increased recognition of low level details (e.g. when musicians take air in your hear it as taking air in), which
I'd promote to sth more objective than just down to the taste. Anyway, vinyls kept spinning.

Cheers,
Jarek



Cheers,
Jarek
06-17-2018 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
N-set
Gdansk, Poland
Posts 454
Joined on 01-07-2006

Post #: 285
Post ID: 24939
Reply to: 22936
Burn, motherf....r, burn!
It took me 5 freaking years to fin-anally install a second set of SUT's in my EAR834. 4 out of those 5 years was waiting for Tribiute Pieter to make me custom silver SUT's on nanocrystaline core. I even found him the wire. I went boutique and the new input path is silver WBT, Pieter AG SUT's 1:12, silver wireing from Neotech (the blue cables) and a TKD switch. After bitching at German mafia I finally went their way too as it's the only switch with a solid silver contacts. The switch was Paul S treated with all the contacts polished and protected with a dielectric grease (Paul I hate you for teaching me this procedure - it's such a  pain). Now the path is being burned in. I found an ingenious way to do it: inject the signal (Hagtech's frybaby) to the input tube's socket and close the circuit with some 6.8R resistors at the headshell. This way  all the path is current loaded including the tonearm wiring and the tonearm cable. 10 more days of burning (due to travels) and I try it! It will serve for a FR64S+Fr7f combo, connected by AQ Leopard.

  Zdjęcie 17.06.2018, 17 56 37.jpg

And who wins the prize for the least optimal layout? Meee!
Cheers, Jarek



Cheers,
Jarek
Page 12 of 12 (285 items) Select Pages:  « First ... « 8 9 10 11 12
   Target    Threads for related reading   Most recent post in related threads   Forum  Replies   Views   Started 
  »  New  Where are our good phonostages?..  Omnigon Tubes...  Analog Playback Forum     61  439958  05-31-2004
  »  New  The Expressive Technologies SU-1..  “too bright” or “resolution” or “details” with SUT prim...  Analog Playback Forum     33  263520  12-30-2004
  »  New  EAR 834P Modification Guide..  Copper air caps...  Analog Playback Forum     38  420924  02-09-2006
  »  New  My Analog Playback: the fat lady has sung..  My analog setup update....  Analog Playback Forum     9  83974  04-04-2006
  »  New  Phono stages with SU-1..  SU-1...  Analog Playback Forum     4  45964  11-23-2007
  »  New  Chasing utopian better phono interconnect...  Did I miss something?...  Analog Playback Forum     6  78906  06-05-2008
  »  New  Buying a last cartridge...  Lucky you...  Analog Playback Forum     80  564851  09-05-2008
  »  New  EAR 834P mods..  Copper air caps...  Analog Playback Forum     38  420924  11-04-2008
  »  New  AMR PH-77: just another phonostage or more?..  Oh, yeah... the sound of the Thing Itself......  Analog Playback Forum     11  86999  07-05-2009
  »  New  An interesting Russian pnonocorrector...  Uber-tweeky phono topologies deconstructed...  Analog Playback Forum     9  57032  03-01-2010
  »  New  Expressive Technologies SU-1 and cartridge output and i..  MV and Ohms...  Analog Playback Forum     2  20392  07-07-2011
  »  New  How to run MM-type cartridge into MC phonostage?..  Quite interesting....  Analog Playback Forum     6  39220  11-13-2011
  »  New  The tales of two phonostages: Allnic and 834PT...  The tales of two phonostages: Allnic and 834PT....  Analog Playback Forum     0  14638  12-21-2011
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