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10-15-2005 Post mapped to one branch of Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,540
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 1
Post ID: 1532
Reply to: 1532
Deficiency of sensible attitude in playback.

Leo Tolstoy use to say that all happy couples resemble one another but each unhappy couple is unhappy in its own way. I think in audio this witty Tolstoy’s idea could be very much applicable …reversed.

All playbacks are the same and only good playbacks demonstrate own uniqueness that I call “sensible attitude”. This “attitude” is not how the playback sounds but the way WHY it would in the way it sounds. The dominating majority of audio people who read this article would be under impression that this “uniqueness” would derive from some better components or from some secret knowledge of the system’s organizer. Here is way I sometime discard that “dominating majority” of audio people, labeling them the Morons™. The reality of the thing is very much different and the “attitude” has absolutely nothing to do with better components, nothing to do with the sets of precompiled “secret know-how” and has absolutely nothing to do with anything else that the Morons™ have in thier inflated and “artfully inspired” imagination. The only thing that counts in playback organization is the level of intentions of an individual who bult his/her playback and, looking at the level of those intentions, it is obviously why the 99.9% of all playback out there are juts an stimulated waste of time, space, money.

Approach those 99.9% of audiophiles who juts paid a large chunk of money for thier new amplifier or loudspeaker and ask them why they did it. If you do research what drove and what motivated those 99.9% then you discover that those people had no sensible objectives and no realistic rational for their actions. They did it because they in one or other way were told to it. They are not the masters who shape this own Sound. They drift among the audio sewers with no sentiments regarding of what they do in audio. They have some kind sound in thier listening rooms, the sound that was accidentally fashioned for them by the nature of elements that they blindly used. Those 99.9% take this sound as granted reference. Most of them do not family with inflictions that “life sound” might have on a listener and even the few of them who do familiar with it do correlate thier listening experiences from “live” music with the experiences they get form audio.

So, what we have? We have 99.9% of audio people assemble thier playback without any references to “live” experiences, without applying own cultural levels (there is a lot of more to it) and without expressing any demands of own constrictive creatively. What in fact they do is juts brainlessly pileing up the bundles of audio ingredients, composing the typical audio idiocies about “synergy” and “differentiation of sounds”. This is very similar to a person who stranded at inhibited island, found an animal-made cave and pronounce the cave as a magnificent accomplishment in architect art.

I love to listen other people playbacks. I like when they large, extended and I demand that they should be expansive. The expansiveness of playback does not relate to the monitory equivalent of the audio components but to the amount of the reasoning and thinking that the system’s owner invested into the organization of his/her playback. A system should portray nothing else but the owner intentions and listening that playback is like reading somebody’s book. Unfortunately the 99.9% of playbacks out there are very-very cheap. Many of those 99.9% playbacks, although they cost $300K, but in realty, analyzing the amount of invested thinking, reasoning and consequential performance, those systems have no worth

As the result audio is filed with Morons who run from manufacturer to manufacturer, from dealer to dealer, form a review to review, buying in own next expectations without realizing they in fact do not search for anything. Ironically the most of the manufacturers, dealers and reviewers are contaminated with the very same disease of the INTERNAL AUDIO EMPTINESS. The only difference between the dead audio-consumers and the dead audio manufacturers-dealers-reviewers that the later deploy, exercise and exploit consumer’s fears….

This all leads to the fact that that 99.9% of playbacks out there are annoyingly boring, boring if they even manage to sound more of less survivable audio-wise. “No objectives” leads to no accomplishment and no identification of targets leas to a shooting in all directions. Of course here and there you always would see some kind of cretins who would pontificate about the “unique ballistic trajectory” of those wonderfully aimed shots flying in all directions, the shots aimed to nowhere…

Rgs,
Romy the Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
10-15-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Antonio J.
Madrid, Spain
Posts 272
Joined on 08-16-2004

Post #: 2
Post ID: 1533
Reply to: 1532
Re: Deficiency of sensible attitude in playback.
I kind of agree with your post. I believe the problem sits in the fact that the people who really cares about music and is capable of feel its intentions, don't care about audio. And people interested in audio, look at it as a "toys hobby", being more concerned about the looks, price and performance of the gear than about the musical results. There's very few people who loves music and is interested seriously in audio too.

I guess where does that "attitude" come from. I have found many people who have a "sounds" attitude and they tune their system to obtain some sonic results, most of them probably measurable. Most of those systems don't play music, just good sounds, and many of them not even that. That "musical attitude" can be there into some people, but the problem is to convert your musical wishes into a system that can match them. I may know how live music makes me feel at a concert hall, I may find that those feelings can be portrayed by a cheap table radio or a modest headphone rig, but in these days I'd have a tough time to set up a system that actually can offer those same results. Most of us must conform with what we can buy, with what our rooms can handle and with what we can find. Not everyone has the time and resources to be really serious and convert his wishes and attitude in a musical fact.

rgrds,

Antonio
10-15-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,540
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 3
Post ID: 1534
Reply to: 1533
The intentions and objectives of those people

 Antonio J. wrote:
Not everyone has the time and resources to be really serious and convert his wishes and attitude in a musical fact.
Yes, certainly it is true. I have no problems with it. What I do have problems is with the situations when people spent no “time, resources to be really serious and convert thier wishes and attitude in a musical fact” or to be more accurate: did not make any, even intellectual efforts, to contemplate audio facts, and at the same time the same people put themselves in a position of shaping pubic awareness and pubic perception about audio. Many of those “audio-professors” love to run this mouth at Internet forums and toss thier banal empty phrases. But if you gig slightly deeper into the meaning of those phrases or if you actually witness the results that they actually achieved in thier listening rooms then the unfortunate picture come through very immediately. Interestingly, no mater how poor thier listening rooms perform still thier sound is not the most disgusting thing. If one is fluent in Audio Language then… by deciphering from listening those audio-professor’s playbacks the INTENTIONS AND OBJECTIVES of those people…. the full ugliness of the audio-pontificating Morons come to thier full disclosure.

Rgs,
Romy the caT


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
10-16-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Antonio J.
Madrid, Spain
Posts 272
Joined on 08-16-2004

Post #: 4
Post ID: 1535
Reply to: 1534
You are too radical

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amlodipin
I mean that you put the most of the people hanging around public sites into the same bag. I think there are several different categories:

- The ones that have limited exposure to music and audio, they really don't care about music, and their exigencies about audio are also very low, but dare to advice purchases to other people. These are the most dangerous and the ones that should keep their mouths closed, but are the most active participants. For me these are the real Morons.

- People that doesn't care about music very much, or maybe they care but don't listen to it trying to "get it", but have wide experience with audio and actually have systems that sonically perform pretty well. If they offer comments about gear performance sometimes it's useful. Probably not to achieve any worth musical result, but to learn how certain devices can act sonically.

- Hobbists that love music, enjoy and understand it, and do know when a system makes some things right enough to enjoy a worthy performance, but don't have the knowledge, resources and skills to set up an "ultrasystem" and accept the tradeoffs they aren't able to overcome. These people may have a very different attitude and objectives than yours, so their systems probably won't have any interest for you, but the systems work for them and might work for other people with a lower exigency level. They aren't a problem for me, in fact some of these people offer interesting information since I can learn how their "musical awareness" depends on some sonic features and not others.

- People absolutely clueless about audio and music, but wishing to learn about both. These people might be the future of this hobby, and could change what highend is now and what could be, but when they meet people in the first category can be completely lost forever. The problem with these people is that most of them aren't willing to spend the time and effort that learning something worth takes. They rather take the fool advices they read, than going out to listen live music and different systems. Once you said these are the ignorants, but if no one takes care of them, they will be future morons or people running away from audio after spending a lot of money in bad systems that never made music.

I much believe that people like you, having the knowledge, experience, attitude and objectives well defined, could help others to define their own objectives and learn which is their own attitude. Sometimes people know what they want when they see it, but until that very moment they're clueless, and it doesn't mean they don't have interest or they're idiots, just that they don't know how things could be, nor the way to get those results using the means they have at hand.

To me the most difficult is not defining some goals for a musical result, I know pretty well how should I feel when listening to certain music, but correlating how some sonic performance provides you with that result. This is a try and error road, which sometimes is quite frustrating.

rgrds,

Antonio
10-16-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Romy the Cat


Boston, MA
Posts 9,540
Joined on 05-28-2004

Post #: 5
Post ID: 1536
Reply to: 1535
Perhaps not too radical but juts liberal enough?

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Sure, I am too radical for an average audio Moronism. There is nothing wrong in radicalism, as radicalism is an advocating of edgy view within currently dominating practices. Therefore the values of radicalism could be measured only in regard of the value of the dominating practices. If one express some radical views somewhere among the Adolph Hitler’s, Joseph Stalin’s, Saddam Hussein’s, Augusto Pinochet’s or Gorge Bush’s administration then this person would be unquestionably considered too radical, so what? If my views are too radical for audio as it understood by the today’s audio-hoodlums then there is a possibility that the views of those hoodlums are too dead, isn’t it?

Anyhow, answering your question. I do not know anything about your stratification of the audio frustrations but there is something where you from my perspective are mistaken. Real knowledge does not transmitted from person to person but grow within a person himself, it should breed within a person and just to be discovered but this person as a pre-existing force. We pretty much have all answers and all knowledge have bult within us and all that we have to learn is to teach ourselves to communicate with ourselfs, to ask ourselfs the correct question and to recognize the answers when our inner-we provide them for us.

Rgs,
Romy the Cat


"I wish I could score everything for horns." - Richard Wagner. "Our writing equipment takes part in the forming of our thoughts." - Friedrich Nietzsche
10-16-2005 Post does not mapped to Knowledge Tree
Antonio J.
Madrid, Spain
Posts 272
Joined on 08-16-2004

Post #: 6
Post ID: 1537
Reply to: 1536
Right, liberal then

I suppose I'm more tolerant, even to myself than you. I don't think that most people are morons, some just try to be helpful acknowledging their own limitations.

I agree that real knowledge about things that matter and are serious comes from inside. But that knowledge can only grow from a substrate of experience. In audio getting the valuable experience to develope some real knowledge is not easy. You may have the right questions, you may have subjective answers about how it should be, but if you don't have the exposure nor the advice about what might produce what you think are your answers, then you cannot have the knowledge.

I believe that you think of most audio people that are morons because they don't have questions, and probably many of them not even are ready to accept that they're into this just for the pieces of kit, and don't give a damn for the music. Don't you?

Regards,

Antonio

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