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In the Forum: Horn-Loaded Speakers
In the Thread: Problems with horns: upper bass
Post Subject: Re: Kerry, let look a very little more seriously.Posted by Kerry Brown on: 3/27/2005

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Romy,

>If Bruce suggests that his folded upper bass horns works better then his straight horn, and if it is correct (do not forget the he said about his horns), then it means absolutely nothing.>

Dr. Edgar - who designed and hand made them - definitely knows more about those horns than anyone else. Since he's not a BS artist in any way... if he thinks his 80 Hz folded horn ( which does have a different driver... usually an EVM12 12" ) works better ( read ' works better in general ' ) it almost certainly does.

And that does - or at least should - mean something to anyone thinking about buying a horn system.

>Bruce’s midbass folded horns that he uses with Titans I believe have 2 curves and they are effectively longer then Bruce’s straight horn with the same mouth rate. So, if we have two horns of different distance with the same cut off then the folded horn should have smaller throat diameter. Consequentially the smaller throat diameter horn would be EQed lower and will loaded as “a horn” lower then the larger throat diameter horn. Also, the longer horn (presumably they run the same curve) should provide higher dB gain.<

All well and good but...

>Even if Bruce uses the same drivers> ( not ) >and if he locks them at the same resonance frequency> ( no ) >then because they are different length horns they are DIFFERENT HORNS.> ( yes )

... nobody ever said they were NOT different... for one thing the folded one is an 80 Hz horn, the straight horn has a 100 Hz Fc.

>It is not a question that a folded upper bass horn works much better then straight >

Who said it was ?

>but that that a longer upper bass horn with smaller throat performs better then a shorter one.>

I agree that longer horns with smaller throats are better bass horns, generally.

>How to quantify and measure up the advantages of the longer horn/smaller throat with the disadvantages of a curved horn no one knows.>

As we all know - including Bruce - the best horns are straight axis and full sized; the question really, is : What's ' better ' - in general, for most domestic listening rooms; a compact folded horn ? or a compact straight axis horn ?

I like straight horns. The only folded horn in my main system is the Edgar subwoofer ( and before that a pair of Khorns ).

However, since Bruce told me eye-to-eye that his folded 80 Hz horn was ' better ' ( read in general, for most people, in typical ( small to medium size ) home listening rooms ) I am inclined to believe him ( even though I would love to be wrong since I have invested a lot of money and energy in my 100 Hz horns ).

Anyways, my next project - if I can ever find somebody local with a 4-axis CNC router who won't charge me a fortune - is to make a 24" horn with a 1:2 throat.

Not that I am unhappy with the 100 Hz horns, just curious.

If I ever get those horns made, I will listen to ( and measure ) each type; in my own room, switching the three different sets of upper bass horn in and out of the same system.

Of course, what is ' best for me' is mainly what I am interested in determining, but I think the ( subjective and objective ) results of that ' test ' would also ' mean something ' to others.

Best Regards,

Kerry



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