drdna wrote:

I wondered if Romy or anyone else has toyed with Sakuma's very interesting topological solutions.  I have followed this for a number of years but my circuit building skills are so poor I figured I would likely blow something up.

I would not call myself to be qualified to pontificate about the Sakuma's topologies. I know some people who like it, they might have iown reasons. Some of the Sakuma's followers take it to extreme, replacing all passive parts in circuits with chokes and transformers. Ironically they claim their amps as full-range amps…  I personaly,  with my limited topological personal experience, is not big supporter of Sakuma's ides and I feel that a full-range amp shell have one piece of magnetics. It might be different in DSET wold...

I personally a am a little cold to that Sakuma's craze. I visited Sakuma 7 year back, spend some time to listening his playback trying to understand what he was attempting to accomplish in Sound. Looking the level at which Sakuma’s attempts took place and the actual Sound that I heard I was not impressed. Therefore I do not have any special interest in  the Sakuma’s considerations and take with alittle grain of sarcasm the Sakuma's flowing…

dazzdax wrote:

Sakuma San is some sort of cult figure among the tube-o-philes. I wonder why he is implementing so many transformers in his amplifiers. Using transformers can be a good thing but in my experience too many transformers give a somewhat compressed sound. I think Sakuma's designs excell in midrange forwardness and purity but at the same time they are quite dynamically compromised and bandwidth limited. As far as I know Sakuma only listen to mono, not stereo.

dazzdax wrote:

Sakuma San is some sort of cult figure among the tube-o-philes. I wonder why he is implementing so many transformers in his amplifiers. Using transformers can be a good thing but in my experience too many transformers give a somewhat compressed sound. I think Sakuma's designs excell in midrange forwardness and purity but at the same time they are quite dynamically compromised and bandwidth limited. As far as I know Sakuma only listen to mono, not stereo.

The Sakuma’s topologies might be argued by engineers. I personally would a grievous you, Chris, and I do feel that overwhelming amount of transformers creates boundaries-restricted compressed sound, but I think there are more qualified people to make this judgment. What however I am able to judge in the Sakuma case was the Sound that Sakuma’s room demonstrated and the most important the level at which the entire installation was built.

The sound was not just midrangey it was surprisingly midrangey, and midrangey only. All those conversations about “energy” that “The Direct Heating” people love to spread about Sakuma’s sounds honestly worth very-very little. Too me the Sakuma’s installation sounded like bad Loather, griven by a brutal solid-state, severely band-pased amplification. He played and number of amps and I had the identical feeling about the results. Well, it is possible that Sakuma, being Japanese was looking for this type of Sound, which is perfectly find itself, but I did not find any inspiration for myself in what I heard.

http://www.goodsoundclub.com/GetPost.aspx?PostID=1959

However, what made to me “get” the Sakuma sound as objectively bad was certain level at which the entire sound was assembled in that room. My experience suggests that at the level at which Sakuma playback attempts took place is not of the level where interesting for me sound might occur. I can bring numerous specific illustrations but now necessary would be?

BTW, Sakuma does not “listen only mono” as it portrayed in articles about him. He stuck to mono because the restaurant room where his system is installed cannot support proper stereo. Even him mono installation was very compromised from my point of view. So, I did have feeling that Sakuma was person who strictly intentionally builds Sound with great sense of purpose at least the purpose the I was able to understand.  The Sakuma audio was to me a rather made “as is” and then added good literature embellishing the after facts.

Markus wrote:

Or perhaps he simply likes it to sound that way? You pursue one sonic ideal, Mr Sakuma obviously pursues a different one. The sound level - does Sakuma play louder or softer than you? My guess would be softer.

Well, it would be very difficult to say about sound level as it was not the audio installation as we understand in a normal sense, were experiences might be correlated with sound level. It was like you go to a used record store, with it’s walls coved with shelves and an small pair of speakers hanging somewhere next to roof. They play music and it “sounds” but there are not audio quantifiable properties in the sound. BTW, I would not deny that type of Sound to be musical but I also would not look at this Sound as anything that worth audio attention.

The Sakuma’s Sound was exactly like that. Hes listening room was a small restaurant room (that was very cool) and his audio installation juts filling spots wherever was a free space from restaurant equipment. The speakers were some kind of manifestation of bi-amped Altec A7 sitting way in the very end of the room, reinforced with another lower midrange horn that was hanging ~5 meters away on left from that A7. Everything looked very settled and it looked as it was sitting there for years and years, there was actually no other space in the room for speakers. It did not sound right (audio-wise) to me and I do not think it has anything to do with sonic ideals. It was filling up the room with ambient sound that came from all directions (no surprise that Sakuma did not like Stereo). It was very gray sound to begin with (He used Denon 102 that I know very much and a consumer level cassette deck with very badly recorded tapes) and since the acoustic systems were deeply burden into the ambiance of the room it was even grayer that it might be expected. It was horribly uneven balanced with perhaps +10-12db in bass. I pointed it out to Sakuma (he did not speak English and I had no my interpreter with me that day) and he showed me to a cheap attenuator that hanged in the mid of his amps and at set balance between HF and LF gain. Sure, we adjusted the balance to make it more acceptable but it has not as much effect as it have to.

I do not say that I like or do not like the Sakuma’s Sound, I said that at the level how it was implements it was not what any Audio critiques might take please. I feel that Sakuma’s restaurant is a nice place to eat cooked salmon, heated from the 845’s anode but I do not feel that the way how Sound was presented was a sufficient environment to justify, assess or at list to understand the Sakuma’s design approach. So, I felt that all literature about Sakuma was just a literature and I did not see any even minute efforts to back up many calms that the literature made.

guy sergeant wrote:

I suspect that Mr Sakuma might likewise not find much inspiration in your system Romy. I also have suspicions about the real motives for starting this thread but that's another issue!

And what my system has to do with it?!!! Whatever your suspicions are I hope it would be better if you understand the mater of subject instead of the premonitions of your psychoanalytic analyses of the subject.

guy sergeant wrote:

After post #1 I was wondering how long it would be before post #5 appeared.  It did not take long!

What is more important however, is how much you expressed on the Sakuma subject in your post #9? If in what Sakuma dose you see only me then you need to rectify it in your head.

Really, Guy, it is not the psychic-anonymous forum but audio forum and I wish you sooner understand that if you have nothing to say in context then there is not need for you to say anything. I really would like to keep it audio-centric and do not waste my time reading your off the base remarks and off the purpose commentaries.

I hope it will be the last post of this there where I would need to pollute theads with my replies like this.

Sakuma's idiosyncratic and esoteric way of thinking (he believes for example that tubes have a "soul") is not to everyone's liking. He is projecting his mind into a sort of tone control. At least for him this tone control brings him nearer to the essence of music (which doesn't have much to do with accuracy in music reproduction). There are certain aspects though in Sakuma's sound that are quite appealing. One of those aspects is the midrange forwardness and presence that gives Barbara Lea's voice fullness and warmth. But will this midrange forwardness also work with Mahler III? Or Sibelius II? Or Mozart's C-major quintet (KV 515)?

Chris

dazzdax wrote:

Sakuma's idiosyncratic and esoteric way of thinking (he believes for example that tubes have a "soul") is not to everyone's liking. He is projecting his mind into a sort of tone control. At least for him this tone control brings him nearer to the essence of music (which doesn't have much to do with accuracy in music reproduction). There are certain aspects though in Sakuma's sound that are quite appealing. One of those aspects is the midrange forwardness and presence that gives Barbara Lea's voice fullness and warmth. But will this midrange forwardness also work with Mahler III? Or Sibelius II? Or Mozart's C-major quintet (KV 515)?

Wojtek wrote:

say how much the old man is involved in all this cult and noise around him? I've also read all the poetic stuff on the site and can't say that this mystical aproach is not appealing. I had the impression that Sakuma just entertains himself making amps which suits his intellectual /spiritual needs and all the rest (cult following) is a result of general Japanese herd behavior weighing a little on the man itself (besides maybe making the restaurant more prosperous)

I did not have an impression that his restaurant was prosperous, quite opposite. However, in the rest your impression is in a way similar than the impression that I had. Sakuma himself is more interested than the rumors about Sakuma, or the “Sakuma’s wrapper”. I have written a about that a number of times at other sites. I felt that around Sakuma there are a group off people who has reason to create and support Sakuma- frenzy, and all that literature, adjectives and legends about Sakuma where the pure result of their labor.  Somebody made others to feel that Sakuma is a comet, a Christ or as Santa Claus.  I did not see it in Sakuma and I did not feel that he personally has needs for it, though I do not speak his language and our “conversations” were severely limited. He does what he does, but unfortunately, as in anything else in Audio, it is impossible to look seriously it what he actually does and how valid it is and as audio people do not deal this facts and results about Sakuma but rather are drooling looking at the comet’s tail…

I think it would be valid if Sakuma amps would make wider public appearance, or people build more amplifiers using Sakuma's principles. I know some people who built electronics based upon Sakuma's idea but they are religiously single-driver people with all following from it consequences… However, in the environment of “openness of audio critiques” I think all “poetry” and all existential mystery of Sakuma’s approach would not be necessary or applicable. If to have a more or less seriously performing acoustic system and drive it with Sakuma base electronics, and then, just sort educational purpose to put in that system something like Lamm ML2.0, then all “mysteries” about Sakuma would not be necessary. As in anything else: within luck of information and with inability of solutions and ideas to compete at open market create conceptual aberrations…

Hi Romy,

I happened to visit your site and stumbled on the Sakuma discussions.
Just in case anyone was wondering what was being said in the two videos:

1 despite looking like a vampire, there was no religious cult like talk. No mention of spirits or ki, not even mention of circuit design or concepts.
2 all he would about his sound were "sounds warm", "I like it"
3 there was mention by the commentator that his designs were based on amplifiers from movie theatres of the 1930's
4 the customers said things like "I do not know audio but this sounds soft and nice", "I am an expert in album jacket design", "I like the food which does not match the sound", "my boss brought me here", "I come for the hamburger steaks, which I never tire of". Did not seem like a cult, thank goodness.

Say, wasn't that a Shelter needle he was using in the opening shot of the first video?

Hope this what somewhat useful.

Tokyo John

Thanks, John. We all adults and we all know how much difference between Realty and what we see on TV, particularly if we have done TV for living. As I told Sakuma might be is more interesting then the cult that I feel purely artificially is made about him. I would not be surprised if behind the boys who what written those legends and glorification about the Sakuma results and translated then to many languages would be the Tamura transformer distributors… When I arranged my visit to Sakuma I spoke with very nicely English speaking gentleman who marketing-wise relay knew what he was doing and who … vanished at the day I arrived to the Sakuma’ town. I personally detect in Sakuma absolutely zero desire to be popular, promoted or any other tendency in publicity or marketing BS. I think if somebody who have no other curiosity then the actual respect and interest to Sound would visit Sakuma, hear his Results or perhabs interview him then it would be much more beneficial for Truth.

nl wrote:

Systems like these are all about understanding the emotional content of the music, not about Sound.

 …the theory that you not correctly presented BTW. Is it in an amp with a half-dozen series transformers Sakuma has the “killing bass”?  The Sakuma amps are bandwidth limited by default, it is what BTW Sakuma went to DSET to fight the bandwidth limitations. Even him with severely bandwidth-imitated playback and with amazingly bandwidth-dear sources (did you even used Denon-102?) felt that he needs wider bandwidth. BTW, there is not such a thing as “optimal loading for tubes and therefore optimal energy transfer + noise rejection”. All those stories were invented by the marketing guy who use to runs the “Direct Heating” magazine and who invited the whole Sakuma myth. The same goes with Tamura/Tango. They are not particularly good transformers (I mean the nowadays mass-production) – they just the pop-transformers of Japanese market. If they were made in Canada then they would be called Hammond…

Anyhow, I am glad that “Sakuma ideas” in amplification works for you. I think you are wrong in assessment of Sakuma sound but I would not argue with you. You always have an opportunity to discover that there is something “more open” out there.