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Posted by Romy the Cat on
12-18-2024
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...and response.
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Posted by Paul S on
12-19-2024
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It has been a little saddening to see the devolution of "professional" audio commentary since I started my subscription to Sterephile, in the mid 60s, when things audio seemed to be looking up. I miss the genuine curiosity and willingness to experiment and listen to and be guided by results that marked the early years of JGH and "subjective testing", when there was literally no advertising, and no quid-pro-quo for reviews. I would not hazard a guess at Michael Fremer's actual audio accumen, but the YouTube exposition tells its own story like thick fog on San Fransisco Bay, topped by a proffered example of sound that could not be rescued by a better server, etc. After MF's build-up, I would have been surprised and delighted if good Music poured forth from that pile of bespoke equipment. Of course, that did not happen. Of course, I was not targeted by this video in the first place. I guess everyone is selling something, but am I amazed that there are buyers who spend that kind of money for results like that following a pitch like that. Truly, what did any of it have to do with audio, let alone advanced audio? One might just as well wonder how The Robb Report stays afloat.
Paul S
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Posted by Amir on
12-19-2024
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I wrote an article about “audio Critique” in an audio forum and Michael Fremer answered to my topic but his answers were irrelevant.
At first Michael Fremer and most audio reviewers have no high performance audio system and also they do not know about proper condition of audio critique, they compare A vs B in wrong condition so their judgments are not trusted.
Their reviewing method is also wrong and they have no idea about it.
They do not care about music and they just describe the sound ,for example amp X has better bass, amp y has better midrange, amp x is bright amp y is laidback and … all are completely bullshit.
Minimum condition for comparing audio equipments :
- advanced high performance audio system
- perfect AC power quality
- Perfect speaker position
- perfect amplifier speaker matching
- proper method for audio judgment
If any audio reviewer change the amplifier (or dac or …) then he should change the speaker position.
The internet is full of wrong judgments and there are very few expert audiophiles.
Audio reviewers do not care what we want, they just help the industry sales.
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Posted by JJ Triode on
12-19-2024
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There is an article in the current New York Times about the stratospheric prices and declining quality in high fashion:
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/19/opinion/vuitton-chanel-burberry-lvmh-hermes.html
It is a funny article but the situation it describes (brand-name mania and huge prices for poor results) is very applicable to commercial high-end audio. The only difference is that the article sees the disaster as starting about 10 years ago, while the audio high end has been going that way a lot longer.
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Posted by Amir on
12-20-2024
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I told before the real problem is the high end audio is very complex subject and audiophiles are not educated by experts.If there was an university for teaching training audio then we did not have those problems.
Most Audio Reviewers misguide audiophiles.
Imagine if most audiophiles learn about high end then they will not read audio magazines.
I bet under 10% of audiohiles know what dynamic means.
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Posted by PeterA on
12-20-2024
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My real learning started when David Karmeli started to teach me about system set up. After I took that old system as far as I could, I bought a new system from him. I had thought I knew what dynamics means. Then I heard 105 to 110 dB horns and SETs and began to rethink dynamics. I have not read the magazines for years.
Good video Romey. I agree MF's video is not about good sound. He does not describe what he hears. I particularly enjoyed the last ten minutes of your video.
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Posted by Romy the Cat on
12-20-2024
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David is very good source, and despite relatively high prices he has, you surprisingly get better results for those prices then out there. I was looking for at your writing "What is Natural Sound". I certainly see David influence. I debated it with David a month or so ago. I understand where you and David come from and I'm not necessary disagree. However, the big question is if the freedom from not naturality food automatically assure a success of messages delivered. I feel it is not. I feel that naturality of lack of this are also the expressive tools of sound reproduction efforts. This is a complicated subject....
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Posted by Amir on
12-21-2024
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 PeterA wrote: | My real learning started when David Karmeli started to teach me about system set up. After I took that old system as far as I could, I bought a new system from him. I had thought I knew what dynamics means. Then I heard 105 to 110 dB horns and SETs and began to rethink dynamics. I have not read the magazines for years.
Good video Romey. I agree MF's video is not about good sound. He does not describe what he hears. I particularly enjoyed the last ten minutes of your video. |
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Dear Peter, Welcome to goodsoundclub.com
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Posted by Romy the Cat on
12-21-2024
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I probably need to record a video about my disagreement with the concept of naturality. I absolutely do not undermine what Peter Express in his website but as I said, I feel it is methodological compromise.
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Posted by Paul S on
12-21-2024
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Is this sub-thread OK here, or should it have its own header?
The idea of "natural sound" is still facinatinating to me after many years of deconstructing and reconstructing old drivers and gear, trying to figure out what makes what sound a particular way. At this point, my own experience is that this is a healthy branch of the Simple Message School, like Audio Note, where "good sounding parts" are compiled to yield nice, warm cellos, classic jazz combos, etc, IMO well beyond what the Magico-alike compilations can do in terms of Music, and a nice resting place for those who can afford it. I understand what Romy is saying, as well, not to rain on anyone's parade but to use the opportunity to illucidate by differientiating his own well-thought out ideas about audio methodology and his own route for his own best results.
Paul S
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