Having lived with back loaded horns for a few years (a few decades ago I was infected with Yellow SingleDriveritis), this topology brings up a lot of memories.

Rommy, if my eyes don't deceive me, I am detecting a blurry 15’’ firing behind the grill cloth located near the bottom of the front baffle. By any chance, is this horn related to: Jensen Technical Bulletin 3 ( https://aafradio.org/audio/Jensen_TB-3.html )?

BR,

Antonis Anagnostopoulos

Antonis, the type of the hormone is your link it is exactly that type of the horn that I do not like. It has multiple bends, it means it has a fixed resonance chamber inside itself. My corner horns has none of it, it is just a mouse a radiating into corner. 

Saying all of it, I am sound like some kind of corner horn expert, and I am not. I heard plenty of corner horns that I very much do not like and I had only two horns that I do like. I did not have any personal investigation why I like it. There are many variables why those two corner horns sounded okay and my presumption that it is a topology is just my guess. It does not based upon any of my experience to actually to make corner horn to sound right. So, if I were you I would not use me for any kind of point of reference as corner horn is an apology about which I have near no personal experience to deal with.

The principle of reciprocity in electroacoustics is a fundamental concept that applies to transducers, including loudspeakers and microphones. Here are the key points:

1. Bidirectional conversion:
   • A transducer can convert energy in both directions.
   • For a loudspeaker, this means it can convert: a) Electrical energy into acoustic energy (its primary function) b) Acoustic energy into electrical energy (the reverse process)
2. Loudspeaker as a microphone:
   • Due to this principle, a loudspeaker can actually function as a microphone.
   • When sound waves hit the speaker cone, they cause it to vibrate.
   • These vibrations move the voice coil within the magnetic field of the speaker.
   • This movement induces a small electrical current in the voice coil, effectively generating an audio signal.
3. Implications for audio systems:
• In a high-powered audio system, this effect can contribute to feedback.
• The speaker-generated voltage can be fed back into the amplifier, potentially causing distortion or oscillation.

a.anagnost wrote:

Based on the above, the BR theory may/can explain the observed differences using random (Altec and Vitavox) drivers:  We need specific Vb for each driver and specific tunning of the horn duct. In your case (since all dimensions are fixed), If I wanted to use the Vitavox, I would reduce Vb.

Ahh Romy…, we are on same page: If I had something (who cares if it’s a horn, a BR, di-pole, bi-pole, di-abolic, or whatever) producing some decent/acceptable Sound I would not touch it (even if I was retired and had nothing to do the whole month) if that damn thing plays Taylor Swift nearly (30%) as good as it plays J.S.Bach (He is my Achilles heel: I confess that it is impossible for me to hear Bach as a background music… of course I am governed by many other flaws)>>

Romy the Cat wrote:

You do not understand what amount of physical and psychological efforts is necessary in order 1 day to listen Dannoy and then completely demolish my setup that I built for 20 years and incorporated everything that I know and believe in audio.

It is very interesting to see how the perception of those things changes with age. 25 years ago I was discovering all of those things, recognized patterns go to work and what does not work and was very pleased when I experience different playback installation and those time after time confirming that's my theories were accurate. Nowadays I am 56 and I do not particularly care to find confirmations or challenges to my theories. What actually make me happy, amused and to a great degree entertain is to see how people which violate my theories somehow made the things work and get positive results. 

I do not do a lot of audio traveling nowadays: messed up former wife, three small kids, lack off economical flamboyance and many other factors. Then I do experience other people installation I mostly do not pay attention what have been done but rather vote capacity exist in a given installation and how faithfully as I play back work in the respect to a chosen topology. This is completely different approach which focus not the way how it sounds but rather analyzing what topology use, knowing what the result should be and paying attention if that alleged positive and negative aspects of a given topology manifest itself through the sound that system produces. 

In context what I said above I recognizes in myself and interesting tendency. When a musician listening at base peach reproduce by the playback efforts then he or she not necessarily listen how play bad place but rather his or her awareness reconstruct a pitch in on brain and the musician not necessary listen the sound of playback but rather use a playback as a generator of different Sonic simulations. This is well research and known fact in this why many musicians do not use fancy playback installations. What I detected in me that when I listening and playback my awareness unveilingly does not listen yhe sounds the system produces but is chasing acknowledgment on giving audio topology.  Sometimes sitting in the live concert at another city listening spot in the concert Hall I in my mind transposite imperfect live sound into playback sound coming from a set of specific audio apologists.  All of it lets me super fast, literally visiting listening just a few bars to make a very accurate judgment about the efforts of a given playback. 

I am grateful then back of beginning 2000s when I did audio literally full time, I developed great listening techniques which permit me at will completely the couple myself from something's if I always called "Target listening" and to listen music as is. I remember when I developed it it was almost like yoga practicing. I was trying to teach my kids this concept but they not getting it yet...

I think you took slightly wrong in my comments that life acoustic bass is dipole. It is absolutely not dipole. In context of listening space it is what we call an objects single point source, where geometrical dimension of radiating surface infinitely negligible to focusing distance. Maybe in a context of a large organ or 120 piece orchestra it is not a single point source but each individual instruments for certainly is. However, and it is huge and very important however from my point of view. The quality of the base that life acoustic instrument produces is rather similar to what in audio produced by the dipole bass.

Well to be perfectly honest dipole in my view not in the top of the packing order but rather infinite buffle. However infinite buckle is virtually not known in audio and successful implementation of infinite buffle is rather accidentally successes then I predictable result. Is very large room, very large open bottle, we are talking 20-40 is an option but in the bottom knee it's act as dipole. When we talking about dipoles it is important differentiate a dipole as a topology and dipole as specific implementation. I have seen some obscene dipole 20 Hertz electrostatic panels driven by 5,000 volt directly couple transmitter tubes. Is that implementation and the sounds very ridiculous but it has on topological dipole non-abusiness that's very much present during life acoustic listening. 

Saying all of this I would like to clearly highlight that I'm advocating the subject this in opposition of my personal preference. I am advocating that dipole bass in order has significantly more similarity to acoustic basd from from live performance. However, I still insist that properly implemented non dipole bass it's more to listening benefits. In my view dipole bass it's kind of easy come easy go type of bass.  I fully admit that non-dipole base has more audio impressiveness which has nothing to do with music itself. However as an audio practitioner, to me that bass actaves are just another expressive tool and I know how to use it. It is virtual impossible to look, or to manage, or to analyze dipole bass for one or half octave. I have very little understanding of recognizing measurable and auditable in dipole bass as sometime different things means different things.  It is like some people who used conical horns for their installations. Sometimes they work fine and sometimes they do not, I do not think anybody was able to figure out why yet. With non-dipole base I feel that I have control and I feel I have an established pattern between navigating sound to a direction and getting a specific auditable result. So, in my view, non-dipole bass is a badly playing musician but at least if I am a conductor he take right notes in the right time. With the dipole basd it would be a spectacular musician who can play different score from the rest musicians of my orchestra. 

If somebody feels as they harvest the secrets of dipole bass and are willing to demonstrate please invite me I would be the first I would like to learn the accomplished result.

I spent today couple hours to listening my new corner horns. I think I need to give a name to it as I do not know how to refer to it. I will work on it later on.  I need to tell you that since I brought my corner horns I did not listen my main  play back. Not because it is worse or anything like this but it is damn interesting to listen to the corner horn  and try to figure out what in me so much accepts it. This thing is driven by Denon udm30, 50 bucks worth objectively piece of shit. One of my S2 drivers is semi magnetize and because of this driven 4db harder. The S2 drivers have not correct diaphragms and diaphragms are not aligned. I use original vital box rectangular horns that I kind of do not like and I have a pair of beautiful wooden 1808 multi-cells that out of just sitting on the floor, next to corner horns I have no idea what response of my corner form installation. Subjectively it has a big wide range bump between 80 HZ and 250 HZ.  That upper bass, that unfiltered 15-in Altec driver has very distinct excessiveness and sometimes very obviously mask out music with lower midrange noise. If I go to somewhere else and heard the sound I will give very specific instructions how to make it better. 

Still, I am listening it and I have zero motivations to change anything. My interest now is not how to make my current sound better but why this seemingly not perfect sound appeals to me too much. I do not put any reverberation channels in place, power regenerations and the whole system is wired with cheapest cables from home Depot. It is not the most accurate system in musical terms. My main playback provokes significantly more intellectual, emotional and aesthetical impact. There are certain rounding off that impact from corner hordes. Still, for whatever reason it is very  pleasurable to hear it. It is not the pleasure that derived from curiosity of how the corner horn system will render this or that complex part. It feels like my corner horn installation kind of don't give a shit how it's present music and forever reasons the way it does do challenge me as an audio person but completely relax me as music listener.

What is very funny is that there is some music which is absolutely impossible to play on my corner horns. For instance today I was trying to play WTC number 2 by Stanislav Richter and the music was hardly even recognizable. It was absolutely remarkable. The very same effect I observed with large Dinlavis, some things they do okay but some music playing by them just not make any mental or aesthetical relation with my brain. I have no idea what it is. However, when music is right, and particularly during complex crescenders my corner horns act like an escadrón of well trained cavalry charges an open field. And it is not just audio expressionism, I have no idea what it is but it's absolutely not expected by me.

My view of the whole system is:

The Horn is conical, defined by the 3 intersecting walls (a pyramid with an isosceles triangle as base).

[As a conical horn, it is a cone with about 83deg apex angle assuming spherical waves, or, about 104deg assuming plane waves.]

Our box is emitting waves at some distance from the apex, so it needs to have an emitting surface matching the surface of the conical Horn at that distance. We may consider that the box is functioning also as horn adapter, coupling the small driver’s surface to the large conical Horn surface (at that distance).

Obviously, there is nothing suggesting dipole operation. (In fact, I am unable to believe that a dipole in a corner would emit anything re bass).

As conical horns don’t have a (well defined) cut off frequency, the low frequency response is defined by the box:

Since we are using the driver’s front and back radiation to feed the Horn, we need to mess around with back radiation’s phase to avoid cancelation. (This is where the bass reflex theory is helpful for tuning the box and adopting it to the Horn).

Furthermore, this corner horn is functioning at a very limited frequency range: The box’s volume acts as a low-pass filter, permitting through the 2 ducts only low frequencies (depending on box tuning). At the box’s tuning frequency, the driver is not emitting anything, only the 2 ducts are operational. (Witch I think is a good thing)

Yes, this horn it is a different animal. For sure it uses the room better than conventional front horns do.