GoodSoundClub - Romy the Cat's Audio Site

Audio Discussions
Topic: Recirculation

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Posted by Romy the Cat on 11-18-2013

A week it trashing audio.

I finished with my client with wish I worked for a while, the contract with a new client kicks in 2 weeks and this week I do not work. Well sort of. This week is a big project on my aim – to reconcile the value of my audio leftovers.

We leave in moderate house but generally we have no space issues. Amy would like to have a few more 5000 sq feet walk in closets but it is rather a perpetual state of mind then a practical desire. We have around 1770 sq feet basement. The basement, like all basements is stuffed with unused household items and… with huge amount of audio elements that are leftovers from my time when I actively did audio design and experimentations. This week, I need to reconcile the value of those leftovers and preferably get rid of the things that I feel I will not use. This is very much not Amy request – she is surprisingly accommodating. I just feel it is the time to do it in my life as I have too much even for myself. Not the last factor that Amy will be moving to Boston Hospital soon and we will be giving up pout NH apartment, so naturaly a ton of new household items will be moving to out basement – we need some extra space.

I do not think that my active audio design times are gone, even if I sound this way sometimes. I have continuing interest in audio and just last week I invented a new topology (!!!) of SET amplifier, sort of a very new revolutionary way to driver DT power triodes. I very much feel that sometimes I will return to my audio experiments. For now I do nothing in audio but juts playing audio – in fact it is how it shall be but I do like the active design phase as well and will be back to it. So, naturally I would like very much to keep my work bench, my large collection of drivers, all imaginary components, testing equipment and etc. The question I ask myself is how much all of it I need? Do I need 6 oscilloscopes, 4 generators, 5 tube testers, 44 drivers of the same type (yes I do have as much 10” Scanspeaks woofer), hundreds of the tube that I know I never will use and many more things? Sure I have my fantasies that sometime we might move and I might want to build a new large ULF bass array and perhaps to employ my 6 Aura 18 drivers or 8 Altec 15G. Something however strike me in this as non intelligent – if I need anything then I will get anything – why do I need to herd all it if I am sure I will not use it. The driver and tube are still kind of civilized things. How about over 150 power transformers or over 50 computer-grade large capacitors?

Anyhow, this week is a big cleaning week when I will be trashing a lot of things that I feel I do not need anymore. For sure I will keep the things that I value but frankly I have a LOT of disposable stuff. I also will be compacting storage. For instant we have sauna and I figure out that it would not hurt if under the benches of the sauna I will be storing tube. Just for Milq have over 200 6C33C and 750 5E5P, do you think 200 degree of sauna will hurt them? It is not to mention that under the bencher it is way cooler.

Anyhow, it is a big cleansing week. If I live in more audio-heavy neighborhood I might did some audio garage sale, it might be even fun. Fortunately I have a different definition of audio fun….

The Cat

Posted by JJ Triode on 11-19-2013

Romy:
I would suggest not to store tubes under the bench in an actively used sauna. While the temperature alone will not affect them, the combination of heat and saturated humidity may lead to corrosion of the pins. Also many bottles are held to bases with glue, and the glue may be weakened (though 6E5P and 6C33C may not have plastic bases, so the second issue may not apply to those.)

The tubes probably aren't a significant part of the storage volume compared to transformers, drivers, etc. anyway.
CHeers,JJ

Posted by Romy the Cat on 11-19-2013

Well, if cause I would not keep the DHT tube with plastic bottom in sauna. Even though I did, purl for run, loaded 4 boxes of 6C33C under the lower sauna beach, still the subject tubes in sauna is rather a metaphorical concept for me then the true need to save space. What is important to me and in a way cathartic for me is to look over the residuals of many audio projects that I was involved and re-evaluate their value and theirs interest in my future life. For sure many of the projects were a lot inverted time, money. Some of them were successful, some of them not. Now I have a full basement of memories of those projects and I would like to see what kind usability I might salvage from my sentimental audio possessions. I found today in basement over 12 RF attenuators. Some of them super duper attenuators that cost me a few hundred doors. I found a collection of TT motors. Some of them very slick, one of them $900 – I was thinking that if my Micro motor goes south then I need to have a very good motor to drive my TT. Well, I am sure my hart stop beating before Micro motor goes wrong but still have 5 spare motors. I have a few headphone amps, including 2 that I build and I do not need any of them, particularly mine that sounded like shit. I can continue this list for very long time without even mentioning the amp and speakers. Do I need to keep all of it?

For sure it is not audio question but rather a question for my shrink if I had one. I am planning to get rid quite a lot. Amy say that I need to put it on eBay. I really do not see myself to make picture and write drooling descriptions – I do not want to be a slave of all of it. So, this week is me searching a healthy balance between my audio spare possessions and some rational. I have to admit it is not so simple as I initially though. I wonder if you guys went over it in past....

Posted by Romy the Cat on 11-20-2013

I with a helper spend whole day today to clear up the basement and we did it very nicely. We re-organize everything and found n a LOT of empty space. I keep most of my audio junk and my working bench. There is something that I even gained and I am very excited about it…

As the result of all my basement remodeling I got a very nice smoking room. I have complete sitting arrangement: couch, conversion chair, tables… I have a pair of Danlavy 3 with amps in there to play music. I do have slow air exhaust from basement. A very nice setting for winter pipe smoking.

Posted by Paul S on 11-21-2013
fiogf49gjkf0d You lead a charmed life, my friend! Be careful of those insidious Turkish tobaccos, however! Yet, even this might be solved with a nice ionizer/air exchanger/filter. Best regards, Paul

Posted by Romy the Cat on 11-22-2013

I never knew that it will be so much fun. As I started the basement cleanup project I did kind of remotely conceptualize that I will try to make a winter pipe smoking place. Instead I discover in my house a new listening room that I have to tell you give me surprisingly a lot of pleasure.

This is probably 15 by 20 room and it is semi-finished basement. It has wide opening to two other rooms, so it has a good ability to care LF overload. The room has my large work bench table that I built year back and super comfy chairs. That is fully smoking room and has own heating and exhaust fans. I have no idea why but it is so incredibly pleasant for me to be there! The room is kind of my today version of man-cave. I use to have whole house like this but now I have in house flowers, carpers, high-heel shoes, plants and talks about baby-save power outlets. It is not that I frustrated about my live on the main floor – I love it a lot but it also it is nice to descend to the basement, light up a good pipe… and celebrate own fake manliness.

Audio wise I set up a separate playback. It is Danlavy SC-3 driven by a pair of vintage Yamaha 150W monoblocks. I always was a bit fun of Danlavy SC-3. I bout it in past but they never sound right in my large room. Here is much smaller room the truly flourish. I always consider that SC-3 is a biggest secret. The larger Danlavy are demanding and room–conscious. The SC-3 have a footprint of a shoe-box, do not go very low and not truly bothered by room and across long wall the throw very pleasant sound. It is not the super-demanding high-demand sound and there is a lot that I might name is wrong with SC-3. However looking at the off the shelf solution and listening the 30-50-100 contemporary speakers with asphalt mid drivers and bullet-proof tweeters I need to say that SC-3 is true remedy. It is just $1200 used and it is just a pleasure to listen them. There is some amazing politeness in them that I always love in Danlavy. Perhaps my super-sensitivity to phase anomalies met the John Dunlavy’s love to first order crossovers….

Anyhow, the room is very cute and I am working on more powerful exhaust idea. There are many options and I am evaluating them. I would like to have good 700-900cmf sucking out of room. The house has center-vacuum that I do not use and I was trying to use the center-vacuum piping to suck the air from the smoking room. Well, it gig not work. With 2” center-vacuum piping I need to create over 2000cmf suction to get 700cmf in the smoking room. The 2000cmf suction it would be good 15A industrial motor – too much for the purpose…

Posted by Paul S on 11-22-2013
fiogf49gjkf0d Well, you already paid once to condition (heat or cool) that air, so the ticket here might be filtered recirculation rather than true exhaust, at least, if you are as "thrifty" as I am. Yes, I would imagine the Dunlavys would be more satisfying than the Celestion 600s under those conditions, and maybe as "easy to drive", too. Best regards, Paul S

Posted by steverino on 11-22-2013
fiogf49gjkf0d Well, the circle is unbroken. Romy started his audio journey in a basement somewhere tinkering with this and that. He rose for a time into the light and now has descended once more. However this time it is called the Bunker. Welcome back!

Posted by Romy the Cat on 11-22-2013

steverino wrote:
Well, the circle is unbroken. Romy started his audio journey in a basement somewhere tinkering with this and that. He rose for a time into the light and now has descended once more. However this time it is called the Bunker. Welcome back!

Yes, I was thinking about it myself. I do not think that it is some kind of recursive arc. I still very much have interest in better Sound that main system for sure delivers. However, what I discovered recently is that listening playback in the way how I accustom is not just sound but an intricate collection of different sensations. I love to have a nice cigar while I am listening. I do not do it in main listening room and it does affect my listening experience.
Now we reached a very intricate questions: what is better- to have great sound or to have so-so sound but be able to smoke some kind artisan’s blend of tobacco while listening? For sure I would say that the better sound is better BUT not all time. Sometimes, it is nice to sit inappropriately comfortable, listen some Brahms, insult people online and poison myself with smoke. During that time I do not need any special sound and to me the basement sound is fine enough.

There is another aspect. Amy and I have kind of same taste in music. As I play my Bruckner or back and she home she has a tenancy to gravitate to listening couch. As she does so we kind of have tendency to become a bit too sensual and it prevents me to maintain myself in the relatively narrow sweat spot. Not that I complaint but I do not like sound of playback during that as I prefer to listen Amy instead of music. She does not go to basement, so I am at my own in there, at least for now and I do know that it will be chair in there not couch.

I do not think that am giving up with “positions” whatever they are. I however feel that there is some very freakish fun to sit in the room furnished with large capacitors, oscilloscopes and large drivers, listen WTC, smoke a big pipe and to feel that my little childish male secret pleasure does not bother anyone. I might go over it in future but for now I am having good time. I do think I need go back to full-time work….

Posted by steverino on 11-22-2013

Oh I think it is very much a recursive arc but not in terms of audio fidelity etc as much as life history. But sometimes we can reculer pour mieux sauter. As big a problem as audio systems are to musical fidelity, the room effect is just as jarring. Nearfield listening or headphones remove that system requirement and make it much easier to achieve fidelity on remaining dimensions. We had a discussion in a different thread on how messed up soundstaging is on even world class systems compared to the live event. It is a commonplace that a world class headphone system is a fraction of the cost of a world class in-room audio system. But it is also true that near field listening also greatly lowers the bar for a world class system. Pierre at Mapleshade also has the useful idea to sit significantly lower in nearfield positions.

And how interesting that the big rig no longer has a sweet spot but instead has a sweat spot.

Posted by Romy the Cat on 11-22-2013

steverino wrote:
Oh I think it is very much a recursive arc but not in terms of audio fidelity etc as much as life history.

…
And how interesting that the big rig no longer a sweet spot but instead has a sweat spot.

Yes, you are very much spot on. I have been thinking about it a lot during my last 2 years. I have written a large article about it but never felt to post it. I do not think that I am in position to observe the arc in it’s entirety but for sure I do feel that the sweet spot slowly converting into a sweet spot. I think I need a second opinion. I will bring to my basement room my local audio guys and will see if it only I feel that the room is surprisingly pleasant sounding or if they would be able to relate to it audio-wise. I am positively-presupposed…

I was wondering… In our house we have name for the rooms. We have our bedroom-room, we have office-room, we have guest room that we call Amy’s closet, we have exercise room, we have Koshka’s, room, we have Listening room and we have Opera room. That is how we refer to the rooms. My new listening room has not name and do not know how to refer to it. Well, this ends here. I officials grant to this room a name “White Trash Listening room”. Ok, I am officially out of closet….

Posted by steverino on 11-22-2013
fiogf49gjkf0d If it were me with lots of spare cash I would have a 1961 Continental moved into the basement and set up my audio system in that. Music always sounds better when you are sitting in your car.

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